Posts: 732
Posted:
26.Sep 2005 - 13:52
I was down Mousehole Sunday and even now, not in the main holiday period there were traffic problems. Also can anyone honestly believe that the type of houses built around a marina are going to sell that well if the potential well off buyers think that they'll be living next to people who have to resort to buying "affordable" houses??? Call me cynical if you like but I can see the affordable house being shoved away in a corner somewhere and certainly there won't be many local people able to afford any of those not classed as affordable. Do they honestly think, as claimed by those in favour of the project, the people moving to Cornwall and into this housing development are going to be bringing jobs and wealth to us? No, we know there is little altruism involved here - it's all part of tactics for someone to make a quick buck!!!
Posts: 372
Posted:
27.Sep 2005 - 18:02
http://www.cornwallwildlifetrust.org.uk/news/news13.htm
Posts: 392
Posted:
27.Sep 2005 - 20:08
Two Jags has proposals to concrete over lots of places to meet 'demand'
Cornwall needs affordable housing.
There is little profit for developers in affordable housing.
Solution acording to overpaid think tank, build expensive high margin housing to subsidise cost of affordable housing.
What does not occur to the overpaid think tank, is that only people on high wages can afford expensive houses, as these wages are not availabe locally, buyers are likely to be second home owners. These people are not here enough of the year too support local services so more businesses close. More businesses closing means fewer jobs and employers can pay lower wages to staff.
The amount that local people can afford to pay for housing drops.
Cornwall needs even cheaper affordable housing.
As so much housing resource is used for second homes demand for housing rises. Prescotts answer - build more houses.
I am firmly of the opinion that certain ministers pension funds are invested in property and construction companies.
If local councils refuse to be a part of the above madness they miss a government target, if they miss targets central government gives more of the money collected in Cornwall to councils elsewhere that have met their targets. Cornwall loses either way.
Posts: 781
Posted:
27.Sep 2005 - 21:07
Posts: 1405
Posted:
27.Sep 2005 - 22:23
I'm not sure I was very subtle!
Posts: 732
Posted:
27.Sep 2005 - 23:32
Posts: 392
Posted:
28.Sep 2005 - 08:23
We have plenty of overpriced 'resorts' in Cornwall and the English south coast has many more, but is this what our more regular visitors want? I was talking to a visitor staying in the village recently, he had been visiting for the last few years, having previously spent most of his holidays in St Ives. He said that St Ives had been 'spoiled' and said of a recent visit there 'I could have cried when I looked across to Carbis Bay' Is this what we want for the future?
Posts: 196
Posted:
28.Sep 2005 - 09:18
Posts: 2305
Posted:
28.Sep 2005 - 10:28
Yeah gods, is nothing good enough for you lot?
Maybe it's that sort of attitude that makes developers thing "hmmm..we offer to put up some affordable houses for those Cornish who cannot compete in the housing market, and what thanks do we get? A big ziltch, and slagged off into the bargain. Let's put up some more profitable houses there instead..."
You complain that the Cornish cannot afford houses, then when someone comes along and offers to put some up, as part of a development, you moan about that too...
Hey guys, why not form your own housing development group and put up cheap houses for the Cornish. with all your expertise, (abiet it's all at decrying other peoples efforts,) you should be on a winner!
Shame that everyone else there seems to think it's a good idea, maybe you should keep to this forum?
Posts: 732
Posted:
28.Sep 2005 - 13:15
]This morning I heard that aborigine groups were not enamoured at Bob Hawke's (yes I know of his Cornish connection) suggestion of burying the planet’s nuclear waste under desert areas. Now that's a subject for discussion i.e. should Australia be lumbered with such dangerous waste products while the rest of the world continues to add to global warming that is arguably adding to the current drought problems requiring high cost solutions, which Australia has to find the money for (one of the reasons Bob Hawke gave for suggesting the cash-for-waste solution)?
Posts: 1405
Posted:
28.Sep 2005 - 13:54
Yes but who are they?
Surely Stroppy you have heard of the process of gentrification, where an area falls into favour with the posh folk and the riff-raff are cleared out. Well it seems to me that this is what is happening to Cornwall. Of course having no interest in Cornwall or it people and community this won't worry you. I heard it was happening in Wales as well, but I doubt that will concern you either.
Bit like what happened to the aborigines in Australia. They got forced out by the British! But I'm sure that doesn't worry you either
Posts: 789
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 00:54
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Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 00:56
Posts: 2305
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 01:13
But now we see the gall of the moaning minies pulling "Australia's attitude to nuclear waste," into a thread on houses being built in Mousehole!! B-WA-A-A-H!
Laughable, pathetic, and unworthy of this forum...
Posts: 392
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 09:08
A lot of people in the world just get on with their lives, they are able to do this because people aruond them or who have gone before did not, but campaigned to improve things. Granted it is an extreme example but millions of Jews died because others just got on with their lives. I live in a nice house in a good area, but I know people who are struggling however hard they work. Cornwall receives objective one because there is real poverty. Thousands of affordable homes are needed if they were all built as a token gesture thrown in by a developer there would be little natural coastline left. Already The Lizard has over 80% second homes communities have died, it would be madness to allow this to extended to the rest of Cornwall. Imagime your own community with shops shutterd for much of the year, busineses closed so you have to go miles for basic provisions and having to make the money you earned in the summer often on minimum wage last all year. This should not happen in a so called developd country, but unless the articulate campaign ( or moan as you call it) nothing will change.
Posts: 2674
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 10:16
No, you were accused of introducing a straw man of MK's fiscal policies when the subjet was the NHS, better left to that thread
A legitimate comparison of possible environmental impact
A bit over the top, unless this was a start to the title of your autobiography
Posts: 1405
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 12:04
I actually thought the Aborigine alanalogy wasn't that far off. Wasn't that a case of money, power and capitalist values forcing the locals out and destroying their culture?!
Oh well, let's try one more example:
Imagine you live in a fishing village in Cornwall, maybe your parents did aswell. Anyway, over the years you have seen local jobs go first in mining, then fishing and then to the supermarkets and high street stores. During the 1980s (whilst many in the South East were enjoying the Thatcher years) half the population was unemployed. Anyway, a good percentage of those people just gave up and moved away to look fopr work, there houses were sold and many went to people from the South East as second homes.
Sooner or later the village has lost half its original population and is a ghost town in winter and becomes full of tourists in the summer. Soon, your local pub is taken over and all the local shops have closed only to be re-opened as expensive gift shops.
Your children don't have a chance of owning a house here as they would have to work in London for 5 years to even save the deposit.
Meanwhile you start to feel like a stranger in your own town and don't recognise it as it is now full of capuccino bars, art galleries, fancy sandwich shops and people wearing Gortex jackets talking loudly about how quaint the place is. If you're lucky they might regard you as salt of the earth rustic folk, if not an unattractive blot on the otherwise idyllic surroundings. The very lucky few are those milking the tourists and selling tat to them or those doing odd jobs on the holiday homes.
Slight exaggeration maybe but this is what I see happening.
If you are a pure capitalist then fine supply and demand blah, blah...
It's alll very well talking about recognition and independence for Cornwall but I think is a little academic and too many people are missing the more important issues of what is actually happening to Cornwall
Posts: 928
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 12:22
Amen to that. Trying to save Kernow's uniqueness will ultimately prove futile if there isn't a critical mass of Cornishness (culturally, ethnically, environmentally, whatever) remaining in Cornwall to maintain it. Once you go past a certain point of dilution, it will be very difficult if not impossible to go back.
Posts: 4525
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 13:38
This is rather circular don't you think? Trying to save Kernow's uniqueness will only be possible if there is enough of Kernow's uniqueness.
Fight for all forms of this uniqueness: the language, our history, the integrity of our land and constitution, our arts / sports just simply our power.
Posts: 928
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 14:12
I wouldn't call it circular zackly, but you're right. Fighting to save our language, dances, customs etc is pointless if the Cornish are driven out of Cornwall (or dwindle into a small, looked-down-on, 'humorous', rustic minority with no influence in their homeland) by house prices, lack of jobs, second homes, unsustainable immigration or whatever.
We need to ask ourselves: Who are we trying to preserve Cornwall's identity for? For the second-home owners who are only here 4 weeks a year and don't spend in our local shops when they come? The incomers who want Cornwall to be exactly like where they came from and try their hardest to make it indistinguishable from England? For the people who see Cornwall as a big theme park? Or for the people who love Cornwall for what it is and don't simply want to milk it for all it's worth? If the latter, we need to make our voices heard and exert more pressure on the powers that be to change the way we're heading, or we run the very real risk of losing the Cornwall we know completely.
Posts: 4525
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 14:51
Posts: 346
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 17:20
And New Orleans
Posts: 2305
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 22:55
Oh and by the way, Hawke has not proposed dumping waste on aboriginal land, but using the uranium mines that have long been in existence.
Some news reports on it for you, or type "Hawke" into "google news" and see for yourself.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,16744916%255E662,00.html
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200509/s1469525.htm
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200509/s1469525.htm
Funny though isn't it, in threads in "Cornish questions," a couple of people have asked for advice on moving into Cornwall, and been given useful tips and friendly welcomes. So maybe there should be a "poor clause" in inward immigration into Cornwall. Obviously those with money are not welcome as they may "gentrify" the area, and we don't want those who have worked hard and earned their wealth moving in. It makes us feel shabby.
Posts: 732
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 23:04
A big assumption there - not everyone with money has necessarily worked harder than anyone else for it. By implication stroppy is saying that those in Cornwall who have worked their fingers to the bone all their working life, but who've got very little reward are not deserving of even one half decent house, let alone a luxury one .... or two !!
Posts: 2305
Posted:
29.Sep 2005 - 23:13
Posts: 789
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 00:54
Posts: 392
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 09:11
Both points in many ways are quite correct, I do not think many begrudge those who wish to live here, take an active interest in Cornish culture and want to contribute to society. In fact to keep some of our towns and villages alive and schools open we need more young people. In my experience these people buy family homes without sea views, because although they may have a little more money behind them from better paid jobs up country in the past, they also cannot afford the £300,000 plus that a small family home costs in these exclusive developments as once they move here they will be in the lower paid Cornish labour market. Nor would they qualify for 'affordable housing' as they have no local connection. Second homes are different, in that the owners are not 'moving to Cornwall' and cannot contribute to society as they are simply not here for most of the year.
There is also a flaw in the UK planning system which makes it easier to get planning permission for holiday homes than it is for affordable housing. Despite it being recognised by local councils that affordable housing is a priority here, they have to follow national planning laws/guidance when making a decision.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 11:42
This thread is about the selling off of Cornwall as investments or to become a playground for the wealthy and not about outsiders.
Another point some of you are missing is Cornish culture is not just about the language and wrestling. There is a definite way of life down here that is more relaxed and less monetaristic than the rest of the UK. And before somebody pipes up with 'yeah, you're all lazy' that's not the case
I've heard about this - a builder I know wanted to do a barn conversion near Sennen. The only way they could get permission was if it was a holiday let. :x
Posts: 234
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 14:18
Too true - Cornwall has always been famous for its friendly laid back, hasta mañana, 'do it dreckly" way of life (and fantastic scenery). That is gradually changing what with the population (and traffic) doubling in the last 40 years and unfortunately some of its character has been lost. For those wishing to escape the rat race it is seen as an ideal retirement or property investment area. Let's hope it doesn't end up just as a playground for the wealthy retired, the property speculators, and summer tourists.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 17:34
ThisisMoney: Sipps will 'hit first-time buyers'
A NEW tax break will allow Britons to spend billions on second homes as part of their pension. The change effectively gives investors 51% off the price of a property. But it could send the prices of holiday homes and buy-to-let properties soaring, making it even harder for first-time buyers to afford a home.
Posts: 2674
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 19:09
Posts: 2305
Posted:
30.Sep 2005 - 22:32
And as the developers of the quarry have offered to build affordable houses as part of the plan, should this be mandated in all brown and green field developments?
Also, should there be a wealth limit on immigration into Cornwall?
Posts: 781
Posted:
1.Oct 2005 - 00:00
The answers are:
1. No
2. No
3. No
Not that I want to appear negative. People with a second home in Sennen cannot possibly relate to the debate on this thread.
Posts: 2305
Posted:
1.Oct 2005 - 00:54
ROTFLMCO!! Not doing too good a job there mate!
Well, I don't have a second home in Sennen, so I should coco then?
Nopw then Joe, try racking your brains a little, and give you views on these, a reply other than "no" would gain you credit in heaven..
Posts: 789
Posted:
1.Oct 2005 - 01:57
Posts: 781
Posted:
1.Oct 2005 - 09:27
I have no problem with people have a first home in Cornwall and a second home in England.
Now Stroppy. Do you have a home in Sennen and do you live in it?
What is a ROTRMCO (or whatever)? When I was going no, no, no and said not being negative, I was having a small joke.
I like you Stroppy, I enjoy your debates even though you (and I) will never change our views. All we can do is try to influence others.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
1.Oct 2005 - 10:28
I suppose you can't see why people might be a little unhappy down here when they can't even imagine buying a place and have to watch others buying places as investments
Posts: 2305
Posted:
2.Oct 2005 - 00:07
Thanks for the pleasant debate, Joe, I agree with you that we may not change each others minds, but we may make each other think a little?
Posts: 789
Posted:
2.Oct 2005 - 03:12
Posts: 2674
Posted:
4.Oct 2005 - 16:15
One in twenty houses might not seem a lot when dispersed throughout the streets of our major conurbations
like Redruth-Pool-Camborne. However, they are usually concentrated in villages and hamlets and thus have a greater impact on the places when left empty for part of the year. With this in mind, the average figure of 5% is probably too high to avoid the well known problems.I might be wrong, but I thought this already applies to developments over a certain size.
Personally, I don't think so. We're not the regulatory type and it sends out a rather nonprogressive image. Massively rich people are not going to interfere in housing that might affect the rest of us.
Hope you had a good visit to the coast and have got the sand out from between your toes
Posts: 694
Posted:
4.Oct 2005 - 20:16
Posts: 333
Posted:
5.Oct 2005 - 00:06
Some people believe the term "brown field" has rather a loose definition when used by some bodies e.g. including both local authorities and urban regeneration companies.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
5.Oct 2005 - 09:11
Correct me if I'm wrong!
Posts: 928
Posted:
5.Oct 2005 - 09:30
Re the green / brown field sites, brown field sites actually have a much greater biodiversity than greenfield sites, so building on them can be worse for the environment. Green fields can be a near monoculture with just a handful of plant species, supporting a limited range of insects and other wildlife, whereas brown field sites usually have a much greater range of plants and animals. The problem is that green fields look "nicer".
Posts: 732
Posted:
5.Oct 2005 - 11:43
That can be true Diane, but when there are such large inequalities / disparities it isn't so much fun for those who haven't got the financial resources and choices of the group that have been able to move here. I think there a danger that people who move here go from wanting to join in and become part of the community to taking over. They then get annoyed when they feel all this effort they are putting in isn't being appreciated. This fits in with normal human behaviour. I’m not saying the people who might by luxury housing are better or worse than anyone else, but you can estimate that a high percentage of those people who would move into any high priced housing at Penlee would be those used to being in control, having their own way, getting things done and very self confident. The community wouldn't be socially balanced therefore and the Cornish because of their lack of financial clout are likely to be pushed to the periphery. They are in fact going to end up like an ethnic minority in their own country, looked down upon or just seen as a curiosity to be occasionally patronized when it suits, by a well off relatively more powerful elite. Well that could happen but I believe there’s enough people around who recognize that and will fight to keep a level playing field.
We are in desperate need of affordable housing for local people, so isn't it extremely anti social to be discussing the building of luxury homes for those who already have a home (and probably an extremely large and expensive one at that)? I quote an article written by the Policy Officer of the Royal Town Planning Institute: Housing allocations, as proposed, reject need in favour of demand. This will result in housing being delivered where it is demanded rather than where it is needed. There is a big difference between housing need and demand, particularly in terms of location, tenure, size and of course affordability. House builders will naturally seek to provide housing that maximises economic return, and quite rightly so, but by allowing market demand to lead house building we will be failing those that need our help the most, those who are unable to influence demand in the market place and who need truly affordable houses to be built.
Those of us who say this are not against “progress�, but all change or all new development is not necessarily progress even though those who want to get their own way would want everyone to think that it is. Development should also be to scale. We should consider what the impact of the extra traffic might be. There is also the possibility that people who buy high priced housing in an area which they consider to be rural, quiet and clean would become antagonistic towards any expansion within the Newlyn fishing industry.
I love the sea and anything to do with it, whether it’s working fishing ports, or yacht marinas, so I am certainly not against the idea of development which would see an increase in the marine industry around Cornwall. I think it’s brilliant. Mylor yacht harbour has developed without the need to plonk a great estate of luxury houses in the centre of it and that’s a better way to go.
Posts: 789
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 01:28
Posts: 2305
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 06:26
Life's unfair, deal with it...
Yes I have a house in Sennen, no I do not live in it. As I've said countless times before, I rent it ot to a local couple, and subsidise them as they do not pay enough rent to cover the mortgage. It is not a second home, as I do not use it AT ALL myself.
Rolling on the floor laughing my ***** off!
So why the complaints about the "gentrification" of Cornwall on the first page of this debate? (Not from you I admit)
I did, many thanks!
Another gem of concisive debate and intellectual contribution from the resident numpty. Where would Cornwall24 be without your gems of insight?
Your wrong.
Isn't it also wrong to be dismissing the building of affordable homes as well?
And I'd like to see your evidence that the quarry homes are going to to be all bought by those that can afford "expensive second homes."
But that's what the MK lot want Diane, they want Cornwall to become a little socialist paradise, where the Cornish and the Cornish alone can live in subsidised housing, remote from any of the challenges of the rest of the UK, and a land where they can build utopia, funded by Brussels, and ruled by a Cornish speaking minority, in the interest of them and them alone.
Posts: 732
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 09:02
Diane, no that's not what I was not what I have been saying. It's because the Cornish have been resilient and tough and adaptable that they've survived so long, but things are changing and while to survive we all should adapt to the current trends where some people move around the UK, around Europe, around the world to find their "place in the sun" it's still a minority of people who are able to do that, because to do it you generally have to be young, have few family commitments and have disposable income, which many people still don't have in Cornwall (as well as elsewhere).
No of course people here are not running around in rags, but relatively speaking they don't have the power of a great amount of disposable income. Coming from Cornwall you will know that historically the average Cornish wage has been low, that many people here have been unable to get onto the housing ladder (yes I know many have as well) and therefore restricted to living in council/housing association properties. If Cornwall continues to attract people with high disposable incomes who can easily afford the high price of even a small two-up to-down cottage and at the same time developers are building luxury houses for those who can afford the even higher price of these, how is any of our people going to get into a position where they can even afford their first house.
The number of affordable homes is infinitesimally small compared to the number of "normal priced" homes already built or being built. Because of its image/attraction Cornwall could end up being sharply divided between have and have nots and I for one don't want to see that. I am certainly not against people moving in, but there has to be fairness and balance.
I'm sure you realise that stroppygob has an extraordinarily large chip on his shoulder about anything aimed at empowering the people of Cornwall to be proactive in decisions about the future of Cornwall. What I am saying (not what he says I and others are saying) is that an estate of high priced housing is just as bad for the community as the other way around. The number of affordable houses in the proposed Penlee Quarry development like in most new housing developments, will be small.
stroppy tries to tar us all with the socialist label, but I have never been a member or active in any socialist group, I have never read one single publication by Marx, Engels, Lenin, Trotsky, Guevara or any guru of socialism and neither have I read anything written by any high priest/priestesses of the right. I just have a gut feeling that I should speak up when I see things happening that disadvantage those who haven't got the advantages of others, including stroppygob and myself.
Posts: 694
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 09:09
Posts: 732
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 09:42
Posts: 1405
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 09:54
I love quotes like that:
You've got terminal cancer - Life's unfair, deal with it..
You've been put in prison for something you didn't do - Life's unfair, deal with it..
Your kids a heroin addict - Life's unfair, deal with it..
I could go on put I don't really think I had that much of a point to make in the first place.
Stroppy, your apathy is inspiring, you'd be right at home in Nu-Labour UK!
Posts: 2305
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 10:33
Ok, so let's review your conrtibution to the topic at hand...
Yet again nothing but name calling....
Saying that some people have more money than others, is rather less of a "get over it" than cancer, unfair imprisonment, or a child being a heroin addict, or are you saying that these strawmen asides carry equal weight?
Posts: 1405
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 16:14
What I'm saying is an injustice is an injustice and to go round making such off the cuff comments as life is unfair, deal with it is extremely dismissive and for all I know you might live your life by that motto
Posts: 392
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 17:05
I accept that life is not fair but nothing will improve unless people care enough to try and change things.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 17:41
Yes, I think that's what I was trying to say! But then isn't trying to raise awareness just being a whinging pom!
Posts: 4525
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 17:52
"There is no such thing as society"
Margret Thatcher
Posts: 392
Posted:
6.Oct 2005 - 20:22
The definition of society I would choose is 'A large group of people who live together in an organized way, making decisions about how to do things and sharing the work that needs to be done' Maybe the word I should use now is community as since the early 1980s 'society' seems to have become interchangeable with 'government' as if paying taxes or voting removes personal responsibility.
As we have the first past the post system many, governments although they have most members in the house, have not had the support of the majority of voters and many of the decisions made do not reflect the wishes of the electorate. Therefore, a population who are being given legislation they do not suport, cannot be 'society'.
Margaret Thatcher was partly right when she went on to say, 'It's our duty to look after ourselves and then, also to look after our neighbour.' More important is what she did not say, which was that looking after oneself should not be at the expense of our neighbour. I am pleased to say that in Cornwall the statement she never made, is ingrained in many communities.
Posts: 2305
Posted:
7.Oct 2005 - 05:53
There are great injustices, little unjustices, life's injustices, and unfortunate unjustices, life's like that.
To equate the relative poverty of some of Cornwalls residents to cancer is at best silly, at worse dishonest.
The wealth difference in Cornwall is not disimilar to that in many other parts of the UK, and is nowhere near as bad as it is in other countries.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
7.Oct 2005 - 10:21
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Posted:
7.Oct 2005 - 11:19
Agreed Chris, but there again, as as happened here, slagging off those who are building affordable homes isn't going to help much either really...
Posts: 2674
Posted:
7.Oct 2005 - 12:32
http://www.carlyonbeach.com/carlyon/jsp/index.jsp
http://www.eden-project.co.uk/carlyon-bay-beach.htm
Posts: 732
Posted:
12.Oct 2005 - 00:45
http://www.stopthemarina.co.uk/
Posts: 2305
Posted:
12.Oct 2005 - 00:55
Forgot to mention the affordable homes, obviously.
I cannot get the e-mail link to work on that page, can someone get me their addy? I've a few questions to put to them.
Posts: 732
Posted:
12.Oct 2005 - 01:41
‘Housing Crisis’ Jim Mckenna, Chief Executive of Penwith District Council has stated that over 90% of the new property in Port Penlee will be bought by cash buyers coming from outside Cornwall. Seeing as the low-end price of marina property in the U.K is around £350000 this is not difficult to believe. Mr McKenna, and presumably the developers also, believe that these incomers will be starting up businesses and giving everyone employment. It is more-likely they will be early- or semi-retired and that their younger family members will be directly competing for our local jobs.
The Council appears to have agreed a sweetener’ with the developers and will get about fifty affordable’ homes built for them as part of the deal. These will almost certainly be built outside of Port Penlee and are also unlikely to be located in the prime traditional stone buildings that will be ripe for redevelopment once the current fish-related businesses have relocated to Stable Hobba."
email address for "Stop the Marina in Penlee Quarry" is contact@stopthemarina.co.uk
If you are against the marina development why not offer help with leafletting, displaying a window poster, car sticker, writing letters to the paper, fund raising or just spreading the word!
Posts: 385
Posted:
14.Oct 2005 - 22:00
Posts: 732
Posted:
16.Oct 2005 - 20:55
The latest plans for the redevelopment and regeneration of Newlyn Harbour and Sandy Cove were laid out before the public last Friday and Saturday (17/18 Oct).
http://www.newlyn.info/cornishman/2005/051013a.htm
Posts: 6
Posted:
27.Oct 2005 - 01:10
I live in Paul and have progressively watched any home that comes on the housing market becoming second homes (some of which are only used for two, yes two weeks a year) there is only a 60% full time occupancy rate for the village and that is getting lower all the time. It is even worse in Mousehole with only a 40% full time occupancy rate.
It is not surprising that the very essence of the area is being destroyed (by holiday homes), local shops and post offices (those that we still have;the majority of the visitors even seem to bring their shopping with them from up-country, perhaps they think we don't have shops here!) are constantly under threat because the permanent population is progressively getting smaller.
The same can be said of the threat to the local schools as if there are fewer children living here full time they will also be closed and like the others that have already been closed probably end up as high end holiday homes so making the problem even worse.
PORT PENLEE
The big businesses who are promoting "Port Penlee" say that the will make a difference with the amount of wealth that it will generate for the area, failing to mention that the greater majority of the "wealth" will be for the developers! The will not be using local workers for the majority of the build (it appears they are already sourcing cheap labour overseas). The jobs they say they will create when it is finished will probably also be filled the same way or be minimum wage part time jobs, and as for "affordable housing" certainly not in the Marina area after all they wouldn't want any "poor people" near by especially if the Luxury development gos ahead as a gated village with security guards posted to keep out the plebs.
The only thing we can be guaranteed to get, if the development does go ahead, is an even more overloaded infrastructure, that at the moment only just copes with the present population ;where it has been run down due to the lack of permanent residents.
Roads crammed to bursting point from the thousands of extra traffic movements generated by the work and the construction of the marina and associated industrial estate at Sandy Cove; Newlyn will come to a standstill.
The proposed opening bridge will cut off Mousehole for a couple of hours a day at peak usage (using the developers own figures of proposed use). Traffic will back up even more and people will then stop going to Mousehole as visitors as it will become even more of a bottle neck in the summer.
And so it goes on! If you want to see the area thrive as a community rather than a glorified holiday camp for the well to do (like Rock) it is up to us all to make a stand against the progressive destruction of our area by developers. A first step would be to join the Stop the Marina group and make your voices heard (rather than just comment about things in postings),I have because I think we need to start making a stand before Mounts Bay becomes a suburban sprawl of holiday homes and the common working man gets pushed into ghettos of cheap low quality housing out of sight of the new influx of second homers!
Posts: 2305
Posted:
27.Oct 2005 - 10:31
Wouldn't a better start be made by putting forward some positive ideas for the area, rather than just the usual :"Ban this! Stop that! No more of this! Down with that!"
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Posted:
27.Oct 2005 - 13:16
And just what is your wondrous plan for providing well-paid jobs and affordable houses to the Cornish population, and cutting down on the numbers of second and holiday homes?
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Posted:
27.Oct 2005 - 14:24
I agree cornishpagan but I think the idea by those in the forum that agree with the Stop the Marina Group was to publicise the issue.
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Posted:
27.Oct 2005 - 14:43
I did contact them and offer them a spot for a press releases but they didn't get back to me. I think they could do with being a little more proactive
As a slight aside, this is the kind of apathy and cluelessnes that exists out there (don't mention politics or upset anyone with an opinion):
http://www.newlyn.info/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=001;action=display;num=1053716743;start=15#15
Posts: 2305
Posted:
27.Oct 2005 - 23:21
How about the Cornish do their best at school, go to college if possible, get the best paid job they can, and buy houses where they can afford them; in the same way as everybody else in the country has to?
How about the Cornish refuse to sell on their homes to outsiders for second homes?
How about the Cornish run for government under the "Build 10,000 cheap council homes, only for the use of 3 rd generation Cornish people, and ban emmet's from Cornwall Party"
Posts: 928
Posted:
28.Oct 2005 - 10:25
Thanks for your typically constructive suggestion, strop, it's good to know that you have real feelings for Cornwall and the Cornish. I'm really looking forward to the day when you decide to grace us with your presence again and boot the local family in your Sennen second home out onto the street. The cultural and community spirit of Sennen will become a beacon for the rest of Cornwall to aspire to once you return to our shores with your love of Cornwall and all things Cornish. Maybe we could all club together and raise the money for the air fare so this joyous day can be brought forward as soon as possible and you can lead us all into a golden age of prosperity and cultural identity for Cornwall.
Anyone got a small daughter who could present strop with a bouquet of flowers as he descends the aircraft steps to place his foot upon our unworthy soil?
Posts: 2305
Posted:
28.Oct 2005 - 10:38
Oh for gawd's sake! I know you lot thrive on nothing but envy, BUT! How many times do I have to point out that it is not a "second home", if it were how could there be a local family living in it?
And I note, with interest, that rather than addressing the issue at hand, you go for the personal attack again. Just goes to show how devoid of ideas the MK crowd really are.
I must admit the rest of your post sounds feasable, can you arrange the ceremony for August 2006? We should be visiting Cornwall then, I'll give you the fine details closer to the date.
Posts: 1405
Posted:
28.Oct 2005 - 11:06
Yes they are a bunch of lazy, ill-educated, ungrateful rif-raff.
Where your, wonderfully well thought out suggestion falls a little flat is that Cornwall now has the highest differential between wages and property prices in the UK. So to earn enough money to buy a house requires earning an over average salary and this in turn involves leaving Cornwall. In the meantime, as has been mentioned in this thread every home that goes on the market is sold to retirees or second home owners.
How would you feel about paying £180,000 for a very average house on your salary?
Posts: 31
Posted:
28.Oct 2005 - 21:43
I have only recently become aware of Cornwall24 and have been gratified to read of the Penlee Quarry/Port Penlee thread; how many of you are against the development; and how many want to help - thank you for your support.
I apologise for our basic website holding page and to those who have tried to contact us through it, I'll reply to you individually over this coming weekend. The new website will be fully interactive thankfully.
Stop The Marina! are very active at the moment although it may not appear so to the untrained eye. We are preparing a letter writing campaign and a supporter's meeting at the end of November. I am also piecing together the new website which will be announced in a few more weeks. We have also joined forces with another protest group: 'Protect Newlyn Coombe', who are fighting against the proposed seafood park (fish processing industrial estate) on 16 acres of pristine greenfield site at Stable Hobba, Newlyn. The two schemes are linked, as are the other six schemes in and around Newlyn. There will be an article about the regeneration in The Times sometime in November. This will probably be in three consecutive installments, we had a reporting team down for a whole weekend. The big supporters meeting/get together will at the Lugger Inn PZ (function room) at the end of November - details to be announced.
I will be posting our two recent press releases and a piece that I am writing for the website which explains how the various schemes are all interconnected - these will be as three seperate new threads and hope this will not cause confusion. I would be very grateful for any constructive comments on these but I cannot guarantee that I will be able to extensively participate in the discussions; I really am up to my eyes in it at the moment and hope you can bear with me.
All the best, and thanks again,
Stop The Marina!
Posts: 231
Posted:
28.Oct 2005 - 21:57
Posts: 6
Posted:
30.Oct 2005 - 01:10
You seem to be very anti the stop the marina group,(in your various postings across this site) without actually having been in touch with them; I am beginning to wonder if you work for the Marina developers or their various co-investors
Posts: 2305
Posted:
30.Oct 2005 - 09:18
How come I moved to Cornwall, and on a health workers salary, bought my house then?
It's what we in the real world call "a lie". Some 20% go to second homes/retireee's, the rest go to those who get their thumbs out of their butts and actually compete in the market.
I'd feel it was affordable. Jealous? Don't blame me for what I earn. Don't blame me for not demanding special treatment. Don't blame me for working 10-15 hours overtime per week.
Posts: 928
Posted:
11.Nov 2005 - 11:09
Posts: 1405
Posted:
11.Nov 2005 - 12:26
No, not really, last year I was statistically in the top 5% earnings wise it the UK. No I just have something called principles and a sense of fairness. So if you want to play who's got more money, you lose!
In terms of house prices, that would almost have been a net loss over the year between 2003/4 as the average house price went up around that much.
And don't give me that shit about working hard blah, blah. I have a list of professional qualifications and 2 degrees, one of which is a first class that I took part time whilst doing 2 jobs. I work ALL the time.
That's besides the point you shouldn't have to be in the top 5% to be able to buy a house.
Average wage in Penwith is around £16k average house price is around £200k - I think even you can do the maths for that.
Times have changed - read the news. $1.2 trillion personal debt, 300% house price inflation
Posts: 928
Posted:
11.Nov 2005 - 15:25
It's your round! :wink:
Posts: 1405
Posted:
11.Nov 2005 - 18:06
Posts: 31
Posted:
14.Nov 2005 - 09:51
Posts: 333
Posted:
14.Nov 2005 - 09:57
Yes we need to think globally every time we think and I don't believe that concern for our immediate community is contradicting that (before someone accuses me of it).
Posts: 732
Posted:
18.Jan 2006 - 23:47
Yes but a half decent nurses salary stroppy which is not good but then again not bad for Cornwall. Did you also have a house to sell wherever you were before?
Posts: 2305
Posted:
19.Jan 2006 - 01:28
So why are Cornish kids unable to train as nurses and healthcare workers and earn; " half decent nurses salary, which is not good but then again not bad for Cornwall"? Why are they relugated to low paid jobs in the tourist industry?
Nope, it's the first and only house I have bought. I saved for the deposit out of money I earned while working in an off-license in Exeter, which also paid for my second degree.
Posts: 1347
Posted:
19.Jan 2006 - 08:30
When did you do that?
Posts: 2305
Posted:
24.Jan 2006 - 05:16
Posts: 928
Posted:
24.Jan 2006 - 08:43
And how many local Llanellians (??
) will be able to buy houses in these prime waterside locations? I imagine, very few.
Posts: 2305
Posted:
24.Jan 2006 - 08:54
Posts: 732
Posted:
13.May 2008 - 12:17
