I could not help read, some of the threads/replies here and just perplexed at what seems to be almost racist sentiments, or should I say anti-English, and it is a crime against this nation. Cornwall is a county in the South West of England, a region of the United Kingdom like the North-West of England, Pembrokeshire Wales, Greater London, or the Highlands of Scotland. They may have some differences from each other, but all British. Pasties, shrinking fishing industry, and closed mines does not (and never will) make a country... 'Cornish nationalists' really need to get a grip.
Few if any Cornishmen do not consider themselves British.
Madness.
I think there's a large, daylight-shunning, silicaceous lifeform posting on C24.
I beg your pardon... I just think it is silly to suggest or want to split up the UK further. It is our heroic spirits and noble history that make Britain great!
I am Cornish and yes I am a Briton, however I would never consider myself English.
I think liamuk you would be wise to go away and learn a little more about the history and status of Cornwall before you can enter into any debate on this matter - I would welcome your comments when you have. I do not blame you for being ignorant of these issues and facts as they are not taught as part of the National Curriculum and unless you have grown up in Cornwall (or perhaps Wales, Scotland, Ireland) where these things are taught by a few
I would recommend that you read Professor Philip Paytons 'A History of Cornwall'.
This is what a BBC website says about this issue. We are Cornish and of the island of Britain. I have just returned from meetings in Europe with various bodies and they view Cornwall as a distinctive region in its own right:
Historically the Cornish have always viewed themselves as a nation with their own identity who were largely autonomous and had their own language and culture. Much evidence exists in legal documents, maps and quotations to back these claims up and it is recognised that before the 1960's there was little difference between Cornwall and Wales in constitutional terms.
Before 878 AD, when the drowned King Donyarth is recorded in the Annales Cambriae as Rex Cerniu (King of Cornwall), Cornwall was known as West Wales and recognised as having a distinct autonomous identity. Athelstan, the grandson of Alfred, attacked the south western Celts in 927, forcing their withdrawal from Exeter. There is no record of him taking his campaigns into Cornwall and it seems probable that Hywel, King of the Cornish, agreed to pay tribute thus avoiding further attacks and maintaining a high degree of autonomy. In 936 Athelstan’s settlement had fixed the east bank of the River Tamar as the boundary between Anglo-Saxon Wessex and Celtic Cornwall. The river still marks the division between Cornwall and Devon.
The Earldom of Cornwall (Kernow) was formed in 1068 and existed until 1336 to maintain a form of independence for Kernow from Wessex (England). The sovereignty of the Earl was founded on, and replaced that of, the British Cornish princes, the representatives of the Cornish people themselves. In 1337 the Earldom of Cornwall was made into a Duchy, the Duke obtaining greater rights over Cornwall than the Earls had previously exercised.
Numerous maps show Cornwall as being separate from England right up until the mid 16th century, the most famous being the 1290 Mappa Mundi now in Hereford Cathedral. Some maps of the Isles prior to the 17th century showed Cornwall (Cornubia / Cornwallia) as a nation on a par with Wales: examples include the maps of Sebastian Munster, Abraham Ortelius and Girolamo Ruscelli.
The phrase "England and Cornwall" (or the Latin equivalent Anglia et Cornubia) remained in use after the Norman Conquest and before the Tudor period laws were typically designated as taking effect in "Anglia et Cornubia". In 1485 Polydore Vergil, an Italian cleric commissioned by King Henry VII to write a history of England, states that "The whole country of Britain is divided into four parts, whereof the one is inhabited by Englishmen, the other of Scots, the third of Welshmen, the fourth of Cornish people ... and which all differ among themselves either in tongue, either in manners, or else in laws and ordinances."
Cornwall's legal right to its own Parliament was confirmed and strengthened by the Charter of Pardon 1508, granted by Henry VII, which added to its rights that of veto over acts, statutes, laws, etc., passed by the Westminster government. These rights were granted in perpetuity and cannot be lawfully rescinded.
Henry VIII even listed England and Cornwall separately in the list of his realms given in his coronation address and, interestingly, Elizabeth I stated that she did not rule Cornwall (but Cornish was among the languages she was reputed to speak).
The forced introduction of the Book of Common Prayer in English on Whit Sunday 1549 proved to be a turning point in Cornish history which led to an uprising known as the "Cornish Prayer Book Rebellion" or "Western Rebellion". (In 1548 the Book of Common Prayer in English replaced the four old liturgical books in Latin). The change was widely unpopular especially in Cornwall where the population at the time only spoke their native Cornish.
The roots of the rebellion can be traced back to the Cornish Rebellion of 1497 and the subsequent destruction of the Cornish monasteries from 1536 through to 1545 which brought an end to the formal scholarship that had sustained the Cornish cultural identity. The smashing and looting of colleges like Glasney and Crantock must have played a significant part in fermenting opposition to forthcoming and cultural ‘reforms’. Apart from being sorely missed centres of indigenous cultural excellence, many would have seen these institutions as being a bridge to the Celtic past, a link to a time before the present imperial overlords achieved ascendancy, back even to the Christianised paganism of their forefathers.
When religious processions and pilgrimages were banned, commissioners were sent out to smash all symbols of Cornish Catholicism. Fresh from bloodily suppressing the Catholics of Ireland, Cranmer’s (author of the Book of Common Prayer) henchman William Body relished his task in Cornwall. After desecrating religious shrines at Helston, Body was stabbed by William Kylter on April 5th 1548 and finished off by Pascoe Trevian.
Immediate retribution followed when 28 Cornishmen were rounded-up and taken at gunpoint to Castle Terrible where many were hung, drawn and quartered. One execution of a ‘traitor of Cornwall’ was carried out on Plymouth Hoe. Town accounts give details of the cost of timber for the gallows and poles to put the head and quarters of the said traitor upon. A chunk of the Cornishman’s torso was taken to Tavistock so that English people might partake of the festivities.
Martin Geoffrey, the priest of nearby St. Keverne, was taken to London. After being hacked to pieces his gored head was impaled on a staff erected upon London Bridge. Intended as a warning to those who might resist English cultural imperialism, such indescriminate barbarity only served to ferment even greater resentment in Cornwall.
A Cornish army gathered at Bodmin on 6th of June 1549 and proceeded to march east to Crediton in Devon before laying siege to Exeter and demanding the withdrawal of all English manuscripts. The conflict had an ethnic dimension as shown by the articles issued by the Cornish army at Castle Canyke, near Bodmin "And so we the Cornyshe men (wherof certen of us under stade no Englysh) utterly refuse thys newe Englysh."
In London, King Edward VI and his Privy Council became alarmed by the news of the uprising and Lord John Russell was ordered to take an army, composed mainly of German and Italian mercenaries, and impose a military solution. Some 3,500 "rebels" were killed by mercenary forces who then moved into Cornwall and brought the slaughter up to 11% of the population. With families deprived of their menfolk and livelihoods, the true figure has been estimated at 20%. The imposition of the book of Common prayer was enforced by the murder of priests and the populace, the destruction of texts and traditions, the beating of children and the use of English in church education. This went on for a period of nearly 150 years - long enough to force tens of thousands to give up their native language.
Many things changed after 1549. No longer do we find Anglia et Cornubia in official documents; the British Sea suddenly became the English Channel and Cornwall as a separate entity was omitted from the maps. No record exists of any formal annexation of Cornwall to England, nor was Cornwall party to the Act of Union in 1707.
Today many Cornish claim that Cornwall has a de jure status apart as a sovereign Duchy extraterritorial to England. A commonly cited basis for this argument is an 1856 court case in which Sir George Harrison successfully argued that the Duchy enjoyed the rights and prerogatives of a County palatine and that the Duke has rights over the whole territory of Cornwall befitting a King.
The Kilbrandon Report (1969–1971) into the British constitution recommended that, when referring to Cornwall official sources should cite the Duchy not the County. This was suggested in recognition of its constitutional position.
In 1977 the Plaid Cymru MP Dafydd Wigley in Parliament asked the Attorney General for England and Wales if he would provide the date upon which enactments of the Charter of Pardon of 1508 were rescinded. The reply, received on 14 May 1977, stated that a Stannator's right to veto Westminster legislation had never been formally withdrawn.
In 1997 the Liberal Democrat Andrew George MP attempted to raise a Duchy-related question but he was prevented by an injunction that disallows MPs raising any questions in Parliament that are in any way related to the Duchy.
Recently Lord Whitty, in the House of Lords, recognised that Cornwall has a "special case" for devolution and on a visit to Cornwall, Deputy Prime Minister, John Prescott said "Cornwall has the strongest regional identity in the UK".
The Council of Europe has urged the Government to extend the cultural, educational and other benefits of the Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities to the Cornish and a 2nd UK report was submited this year with a decision due in late 2006.
Some progress has been made with the inclusion for the first time of an ethnic code (06) for the Cornish on the 2001 UK Census and the Cornish language was at last officially recognised by the government in 2002, followed by some government funding in 2005.
Despite all of this at present Cornwall is the only Celtic nation (out of Cornwall, Brittany, Galicia, the Irish Republic, Isle of Man, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales) that has no form of effective self-government.
Anonymous
Posted: 08.08.2006, 21:44
Unregistered User
I agree 100% Liamuk, I and many of my friends of much younger ages than most of the old gits on here consider our self's to be English and are very proud of it.If you had gone into the pubs during the world cup like I did they were packed with people born in Cornwall wearing England shirts and St Georges flags.I have a St Georges flag flying right now out side my house in Truro.And once again I was born in Truro SO WHAT........
In this world we have to put up with the uneducated, the ignorant, and the toadies. We see all too often in here as well as elsewhere these pathetic specimens of Humanity. We have to read or listen to them claiming their warped and twisted so called facts. It is a sad inditement that in this so called educated time, our fellow Beings show that blindness and down right crass stupidity, is still what drives them. It is at a time of greater knowledge for mankind which is supposedly open top all. That we still get their pathetic drivel. I know that as a Humaitarian that i should accept that some people just cannot see the truth, but by god it still infuriates me to hell. As someone who was born and lived in Truro for most of my life and I know most all of the old Truro Families, and i am more than likely related to them all in some way. It gives me no joy to hear from Truro Born and his crap. If you want to be English then thats your choice, but shut the F*** up when you try to label others in here. You are very ignorant, and you do yourself no favours by making yourself look even more stupid than you actually are.
As for Liam, go and educate yourself, then at least try to have some sort of input from a postion of knowledge, and not one based upon ignorance, thank you.
It is extremely small-minded to trust or form your opinions around the apathetic perspectives of those placing higher regard for the last 400 years of illegal English dominance in Cornwall, than understand/appreciate the far more significant number of years preceeding them - where a natural defence for Cornwall's independence went unquestioned because of its long-understood independent status.
Your opinions are your own, but it is my feeling that they are based on too much value being placed on 'the way things are', rather than 'the way things were'. World events prove the concept that the only constant is change.
Your use of cliches only serves to reinforce a complete lack of understanding of Cornwall and the other nations/areas you mention. Please educate yourself.
NEWQUAY AIRPORT CLOSURE: “HEADS MUST ROLL”
Stephen Gilbert, the prospective local MP for Newquay, has said that “heads must roll” over the unexpected closure of Newquay Airport and has called for a full enquiry into what went wrong.
Important Information regarding Air Southwest flights to/from Newquay Airport.
We have been advised that Newquay Airport will be closed from 1 December to 19 December 2008 inclusive. This is due to issues with the handover of air traffic control from the RAF to the airport authority.
English Heritage get one thing right at least
English heritage have joined with a variety of other organisations in opposing the planned incinerator in St. Dennis on grounds that they have failed to recognise or address the impact that the proposals will have on the wider landscape of St. Dennis.
MANX GOVERNMENT SUFFER WORST HUMILIATION BY THE UK IN LIVING MEMORY
The Isle of Man government and its Chief Minister have been shown to be inept and marginalised following comments from the United Kingdom Prime Minister and his Chancellor Alistair Darling over the past few weeks.
Population is older and lonelier
People living in Devon and Cornwall are generally older and lonelier than elsewhere in the UK, a BBC survey finds.
Grey majority rules in Cornwall
Cornwall has the highest proportion of retirement age residents in the UK, according to a BBC survey.
Airport flight suspension begins
A three-week suspension of flights in and out of Newquay Airport in Cornwall is under way.
Soldiers families record messages
The families of South West territorial army soldiers gather in Devon to record Christmas messages to them.
