Beach Ices at Praa Sands
Ice meeting the sand at the base of the low cliff behind Praa Sands Beach, West Cornwall. 6th January 2009....
Icicles at Trewellard Bottoms
Water seeping through a wall is turned to icicles, ate Trewellard Bottoms, where Geevor Mine meets the sea....
Winter Sunset at Levant
A late afternoon scene, at Levant Mine, West Cornwall. 7th January 2009....
Winter at Levant
The old electricity generator building, at Levant Mine, West Cornwall, during the recent cold snap. 7th Jnauary 2009....
I feel very sorry for poor old, highly confused Enzedbrit who appears to have swallowed the reference book used by UK public servants when dealing with ethnic issues. There is no rhyme nor reason to any of the arguments which he deploys. He is a product of a state which, although professing to be tolerant and fair, has produced ethnic categorisations that bear no resemblance to the guidelines fixed in law. Confusion reigns supreme.
For the record, the legal definition of ethicity, set in the English courts by Lord Fraser in 1983 was set down in the Mandla Dowel v. Lee case. His Lordship set very clear criteria for defining ethnicity.
Since this is the only legal precedent in this country, it is the only basis for those who wish to challenge the system in the UK as it relates to ethnicity. Lord Fraser's judgement does not concern your skin colour, where you were born, or your nationality and Enzedbrit clearly has missed this extremely important point.
Let me illuminate him/her a little further:
Despite the shouting, British is not a recognised ethnic group as it does not possess Race Relations Act caselaw precedent. IMO, it would be impossible for "British" to win a Race Relations Act ethnic classification on the linguistic criteria alone since there is no single, British language, let alone the failures in other cultural criteria laid down by the law lord in 1983.
On the other hand, Scottish, Welsh and English are recognised groups under the RRA as they do possess caselaw history.
Ethnicity has got absolutely diddley squat to do with ones parents or ancestry - look at the Fraser judgement.
No, you are not, as outlined above, that would be impossible and ridiculous. You can be, however, Welsh, Scottish, Cornish or English, all of which qualify on linguistic grounds as they satisfy the Fraser criteria. In fact, the English group cannot claim to be indigenous British as it is a newcomer with German roots!
Despite claiming to be directly linked to the indigenous British people of these islands, you cannot claim to be ethnically "British" on this basis alone since those original people were members of several different linguistic backgrounds themselves. Were they all the same, then, perhaps, your claim would make more sense and you would have a more sensible argument.
You seem to have forgotten that I originally questioned your claim to belong to a so-called "British" ethnic group, a group that fails hopelessly to satisfy the legal precedent set by Lorfd Fraser. However, I have an open mind and am perfectly willing to learn how you may overcome this internationally recognised legal precedent.
To return to your assertion....
No, there are no Cumbrian, Northumbrian ethnic groups. Cumbrian might well have had a legitimate claim a few hundred years ago when the Brythonic language of that region was spoken. Today, Cumbrian is not spoken and there is, therefore, no Cumbrian ethnicity. Northumbrian's situation is even worse since there never was a Northumbrian language that is wholly seperate from the language of the ethnically English group. They speak an early dialect of English but, I am afraid that dialects of English in this instance do not satisfy Lord Fraser's criteria and your claim there to be a Northumbrian ethnicity must be similarly dismissed.
Likewise, similar claims to a Kentish ethnicity, a Yorkshire ethnicity and A Devonshire ethnicity are similarly and critically flawed.
And what distinct seperate language do they speak other than their local dialect of English? Sorry, any claim to Yorkshire ethnicity is entirely spurious and would be doomed to failure were those who advanced such ridiculous causes ever to attempt to bring a case to the courts.
Well, I suppose there is hope! However, the only example above that qualifies as an ethnic group is the "English".
Those are matters for the courts under the Race Relations Act. You will be aware that moves have been made recently by members of the Cornish Stannary Parliament to address this issue, even though for many purposes, for example censuses, the health service and linguistically, the Cornish are already recognised. If your convictions and arguments are strong, you should have no reservations about going to court on a discrimination case to secure official recognition for your ethnic group.
The fact that the state is currently employing bogus groups for ethnic monitoring purposes is very likely to be challenged in the courts in the not too distant future. With this in mind, I would advise you to undertake more research to assist you in your attempt to obtain RRA recognition for your, at the moment, hypothetical and completely unrecognised ethnic backgrounds.
You are right on this one. As I said earlier these are matters for the courts. However, I was not aware that the CRE (soon to be replaced by the Commission for Human Rights) was profit orientated. It deals with the law (RRA) and the law is available for any citizen aggrieved.
Ughh? I am afraid that it is not the Cornish who need worry about their public image on a World scale, it is those who do not wish to recognise the Cornish minority, and its perfectly legitimate aspirations, who need to be concerned!
Being Celtic is all about linguistics and celtic languages. Without these important aspects, "Celtic" would be nothing. Bagpipes and tartans are simply more recent add-ons.
That people from Northumberland might play bagpipes does not make them Celtic and it does not make them ethnically Northumbrian. The only thing that would make them Northumbrian would be a distinct Northumbrian language, rather than a Northumbrian dialect of English. You might mention any "ethnic" qualifications as you wish but, unless they are consistent with, and satisfy the Fraser judgement, they are fanciful and meaningless.
If Northumberland could prove that it had a living Celtic language, then yes, I would agree with you. But, to my knowledge, it hasn't!
You will be claiming next that you are an ethnic "bog man" on the basis that you are wearing brown underpants!
But without being able to satisfy the Fraser judgement, your candle has been snuffed out. The Cornish aren't responsible for this misfortune - it is the weakness of your ethnic credentials that has encouraged a butterfly to fly past your candle and blow it out.
Firstly, nobody on this forum has failed to acknowledge the Celtic history of the whole of Britain. However, it is quite spurious for you to claim that Celticism is a central part of your specific identity because the developments that led to the complete eradication of the Celts from what is now England, took place 1100 years ago. However, as you know, Celtic linguistic traditions did not die out in places like Cornwall, Wales and Scotland, a fact which guarantees their status as bone fide groups at this time. Today, you can only claim to be Celtic if you are affiliated to, and accepted by, one of the traditional, recognised Celtic cultural groups or nations.
Someone from Cumbria - except it seems that NZB isn't, just a supporter of their identity. As he claims to be a native speaker of both English and Welsh, he's presumably either of mixed parentage or from the Welsh Borders.
EDIT BIT: I should have added that he is also proud to be both Welsh and English to come to the above conclusion END EDIT BIT.
By the way,
Hear Hear! 8) I detest having to tick boxes describing myself as "ethnically" white
Seeing as the discussion is about enzedbrit, I will put in my twopence worth. What comes over most strongly is that he seems to be a very mixed up person. not sure of his roots possibly and therefore grasping at straws. What is disturbing is that his Historic claims are not worth anything, for they have no evidence in support of them. The same on the claims of some Celtic links in present day England.
Just because a People lived in an Area some time in the past does not mean that the present Population can claim any link to them. Thats like saying the White People in New Zealand have a link to the Moari, or that Whites, Blacks and Hispanics in America can claim Native American links. It is just rediculous, as are all these Celtic claims from Devon etc.
His claim that English People have a link to the original People of Britain, is also laughable. it seems in his mind that all those Historians and Writers from that Era, well they all got it wrong when they wrote that the Saxons etc came from the Continent and settled. Surely these People they wrote about must of been on a Boat Trip out of Bognor Regis. God how did we miss that one. Maybe they went to Holland to get 'Herbal' treatment for Arthritus ummmmmm.
I checked the link and it seems he claims to be both Welsh and English. Hunderds of Years of English Propoganda has certainly left it's mark with this Man. It's a shame that he cannot open his Eyes a bit more, for I a quite certain he could actually contribute something when he does, instead of making himsellf look stupid.
His views on Cornish matters also show a total lack of knowledge on the Subject, making his postings both laughable and offensive. So I would suggest to him to make sure of his facts befroe making another posting, as so many times he has been shown to be lacking in all areas.
When the Saxons (or whoever) invaded maybe a few tens of thousands of them imagrated to britain (im not an expert and im only postulating, so if someone has figures?)...
The stock of celtic blood was still abundant, what the invading peoples did was displace the culture of the celts and interbreed. So does that mean they stopped being Celts??? And became Saxons? Does that mean they are genetically Britsh? and Ethnically Saxon? Then i spose when the next invaders came they became Ethnically Norman?
I still dont agree with NZB aproach but maybe this is what hes getting at? :P
At least the Cornish were not conquerred so we are definetly Celts... but we have definetly interbred?
This is enzedbrit's view, but I am afraid that there is no Historical evidence to back up this theory. All the evidence we have shows the opposite, Battles, displacement and death. I am sure however that a certain ammount were integrated, but I do not think that it goes anyway near to poluting the Saxon Bloodstock. The Historical records do not say anywhere that this integration took place, therefore we must assume that it didn't. If anyone can show that it even happened in a smalll way, then let them do that with Historical references. We know that in the last few Hundred years that this has changed, but up untill them we can only assume that the different Peoples in Britain remained pretty pure.
Place-name evidence alone suggests that it was not as some suggest that the, "the Germanic tribes were welcomed with open arms and requested union with indigenous British spouses", or words to that effect. Bearing in mind the almost total lack of Celtic place-name elements throughout what is now known as England, it is more likely that an ethnic cleansing took place. This probability is backed up by the Anglo-Saxon Chronicles which reports a never-ending series of bloody victories against the Celts of Britain.
It is pointless, and, indeed, dangerous to suggest that there are any racial differences between the indigenous Celts of Britain and the Anglo-Saxons of the Germanic regions. However, it is perfectly reasonable to claim vast cultural/ethnic differences between these groups.
Hunlef, where did this quote come from? i am just curious.
If this did happen, which I believe it did not, then the Saxons would of eventually been assimilated into Celtic Society, and not the other way around. I do agree that some sort of Ethnic Cleansing took place, and as you state the Anglo-Saxon Chronicles makes this quite clear, as do other sources.
I also agree that Racially there is very little difference between many of the European Peoples, and that it would of been Cultural and Ethnic. Athelstan makes it quite clear how these Germanic Peoples looked upon the Celtic Stock. I just cannot see how regarding all the Historical evidence, how anyone can come up with this absurd theory of integration into Saxon Society. When you sum up all the evidence, you can only come to one conclusion, and that is these claims are being made to belittle the Celtic calls of difference and autonomy. Nothing else makes sense.
Rise in county's road death toll
The number of people who have died on Cornwall's roads rises in the last year to 35, police say.
Film con man ordered to pay £100K
The man who swindled almost £2m in a film studio scam is ordered to forfeit £100,000 by a judge.
Triplets survive against the odds
A woman from Cornwall who gave birth to triplets 14 weeks early describes their survival as a "miracle".
Call for inquiry into fire centre
Fire chiefs demand a public inquiry into the delayed opening of the regional fire control centre.
Prison sentence for benefit cheat
A man who admitted swindling more than £51,000 in benefits over a six-year period is jailed for 18 months.
Divers face trial over shipwreck
Three Cornish divers accused of plundering a shipwreck off the coast of Spain are to be tried in a Spanish court.
‘NO’ TO NUCLEAR WASTE IN CORNWALL - MPs
Proposals to bring nuclear waste to Cornwall have been described as ‘absurd and irresponsible’ by Cornish MPs.
Route Partnership Plan for Penzance unnecessary
Their plan having been rejected by the public in the final exhibition in Septmber with 90% against the Route Partnership have decided to try again in mid January after a mailout and poster campaign.The Chamber of Commerce has been at the forefront of this campaign.
ROTFL 
