search pnForum latest posts Note: Registered users can subscribe to notifications about new posts Note: Registered users can subscribe to notifications about new posts

Print topic to next topic

Start ::  Cornwall24 Discussion ::  Cornwall24 Discussion Board ::  Cornwall excluded from Framework convention report..
Moderated by: Admins

Goto page : Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 Next Page
Bottom 

Cornwall excluded from Framework convention report..

TGG Posted: 09.03.2007, 12:15

TGG

registered: Aug. 2005
Posts: 1119

Status: offline
last visit: 07.01.09
Regrettably, Europe can only investigate the UK Compliance Report and express 'an opinion' on it and make certain suggestions/reccommendations. It is in the process of doing this and will be meeting a Cornish delegation on Thursday 22nd March. What Sentinel and I are trying to point out is the total unwillingness(?) for 'the wider Cornish Movement' to carry this event through to a PUBLIC debate. The Question this raises is: Are there really any Cornish people left out there who care? Perhaps another poll? (q.v. fate of petitions)

TGG

http://www.kernowtgg.co.uk



edited by: TGG, Mar 09, 2007 - 12:16 PM

STOP THE CORNISH GENOCIDE!- The existence of divergent views occur because the lies and deception have a more profoundly negative, and contrived, consequence for the Cornish people than for anyone else within the UK.
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
1549 Posted: 09.03.2007, 12:30

1549

registered: Jun. 2006
Posts: 206

Status: offline
last visit: 12.04.07
QuoteRegrettably, Europe can only investigate the UK Compliance Report and express 'an opinion' on it and make certain suggestions/reccommendations. It is in the process of doing this and will be meeting a Cornish delegation on Thursday 22nd March. What Sentinel and I are trying to point out is the total unwillingness(?) for 'the wider Cornish Movement' to carry this event through to a PUBLIC debate. The Question this raises is: Are there really any Cornish people left out there who care? Perhaps another poll? (q.v. fate of petitions)

Here's one that cares !

Communities and Local Government
Convention for the Protection of National Minorities
Written answers
Tuesday, 6 March 2007

Andrew George (St Ives, Liberal Democrat)

To ask the Secretary of Statefor Communities and Local Government what consideration her Department gave to the application on behalf of the Cornish for inclusion in the European Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reply from Meg Munn (Parliamentary Under-Secretary (Women and Equality), Department for Communities and Local Government)

The United Kingdom ratified the Framework Convention on the understanding that it would be applied with reference to "racial groups" within the meaning of Section 3(1) of the Race Relations Act 1976, which is to say any groups defined by "colour, race, nationality or national or ethnic origins". For the purposes of the Framework Convention it would of course also be necessary for the group to be a minority in the UK.

Since the United Kingdom Government ratifiedthe Framework Convention, a number of Cornish organisations and individuals have made representations to the Government arguing that the Cornish should be considered within the scope of the Framework Convention's application in the United Kingdom. The Government therefore included Cornish organisations in its consultation prior to the preparation of this 2(nd) report under the Framework Convention. It also circulated the draft report to a number of Cornish organisations and individuals which had approached the Government on the issue since then.

A number of these organisations and individuals submitted comments on the draft report. The Government have considered the arguments put forward for the inclusion, but has not been convinced that a move away from the definition of racial group in Section 3(1) of the Race Relations Act 1976 can be justified.

The Government consider that the UK's enormous diversity, embracing individuals of many different (and sometimes multiple) ethnic, national, cultural and faith identities is a matter for celebration and a source of national strength.

The Government are very much aware of the strength of feeling about Cornwall's separate identity and distinctiveness. icon_confused The fact that some groups may not meet the definition of racial group from the Race Relations Act 1976 has not been a barrier to the UK's many communities being able to maintain and celebrate their distinct identities.
icon_confused icon_lol

http://www.they...2#g123757.q0
Top  Profile send PM
 
frenchie Posted: 09.03.2007, 12:35



registered: Jan. 2006
Posts: 1691

Status: offline
last visit: 28.04.07
QuoteThe Question this raises is: Are there really any Cornish people left out there who care? Perhaps another poll?


How about a public inquiry? Started by the public.

1d3az b3c0m3 th0ught5, th0ughtz b3c0m3 1n1t1at1v35, 1n1t1at1v3z b3c0m3 act10n5, act10nz br1ng chang3..
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
Fulub-le-Breton Posted: 09.03.2007, 12:52

Fulub-le-Breton

registered: Sep. 2004
Posts: 4667

Status: offline
last visit: 09.01.09
Surely an open letter to the Cornish press written/signed by Andrew George, John Angarrack, Bert Biscoe plus others from inside and outside the Duchy would get some publicity.

Such a public letter would be hard to ignore!

The Cornish Democrat
The Breton Connection
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
TGG Posted: 09.03.2007, 13:59

TGG

registered: Aug. 2005
Posts: 1119

Status: offline
last visit: 07.01.09
1549 - Posted: 09.03.2007, 12:30
Here's one that cares !


Use of the singular noted, but still not a PUBLIC debate however much Andrew's intervention is appreciated. I like Fulub's idea of a jointly signed letter to kickstart a public debate but would such a device be forthcoming? It is for the suggested people to take such an initiative!

The official reply to Andrew's question is only a dismissive quote from the 2nd Compliance Report which, however one reads it, is entirely without substance and deliberately does not answer his question.

Until the EIS spells out why we are officially discriminated against, we are deprived from responding. If the reasons are 'because Cornwall is an English county(sic) and the Cornish are English(very sic), then why are they afraid to say it? Afraid, perhaps to open the debate into forbidden territory?

TGG

http://www.kernowtgg.co.uk



STOP THE CORNISH GENOCIDE!- The existence of divergent views occur because the lies and deception have a more profoundly negative, and contrived, consequence for the Cornish people than for anyone else within the UK.
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
frenchie Posted: 09.03.2007, 14:13



registered: Jan. 2006
Posts: 1691

Status: offline
last visit: 28.04.07
A public inquiry, initiated by the public, held in public, to investigate the situation, and reach an understanding of, the constitutional position of Cornwall that makes sense to both the public and is valid in the eyes of the law.

You don't need the backing or approval of any authorities to hold a public inquiry.

You need a public wanting to inquire..

1d3az b3c0m3 th0ught5, th0ughtz b3c0m3 1n1t1at1v35, 1n1t1at1v3z b3c0m3 act10n5, act10nz br1ng chang3..
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
Ellery Posted: 10.03.2007, 01:46

Ellery

registered: Jan. 2007
Posts: 293

Status: offline
last visit: 14.12.08
Fulub-le-BretonSurely an open letter to the Cornish press written/signed by Andrew George, John Angarrack, Bert Biscoe plus others from inside and outside the Duchy would get some publicity.

Such a public letter would be hard to ignore!


Get as many as possible to sign it! Page after page of signatures!
I'll sign it!

We will make Cornwall see the lies.
We will open up their eyes.
We Cornish born and bred.
We fight on till we all are dead,
and listen for Palores' cries!
Top  Profile send PM
 
sentinel Posted: 10.03.2007, 21:26



registered: Aug. 2006
Posts: 835

Status: offline
last visit: 17.11.08
Petition the Government - don't even go there!

Remember the last one? Signed by 50,000, and promptly eaved in the bin!!!!

MP's are asking the wrong questions. Too much wiggle room. The pre-recorded answers were inevitable.

Watch this space.


Top  Profile send PM
 
Fulub-le-Breton Posted: 11.03.2007, 14:12

Fulub-le-Breton

registered: Sep. 2004
Posts: 4667

Status: offline
last visit: 09.01.09
Sentinel,

The petition of 50,000 might have been badly followed up but it raised the profile of Cornish autonomy and brought the debate to more Cornish residents in a way that no other Cornish groups has ever managed.

It has also given strong evidence that support for Cornish autonomy exists in the Duchy, without it the accusation that the Cornish nationalists represent themselves and their dogs only would be much easier to throw around.

As important as a human rights court victory is to engage with the Cornish public and convince them that greater political autonomy is a good idea.

The Cornish Democrat
The Breton Connection
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
Fulub-le-Breton Posted: 12.03.2007, 10:29

Fulub-le-Breton

registered: Sep. 2004
Posts: 4667

Status: offline
last visit: 09.01.09
UK continues to exclude Cornish from FCNM protection, the latest from the eurolang news site: http://www.euro...id=1&lang=en

The Cornish Democrat
The Breton Connection
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
frenchie Posted: 15.03.2007, 13:23



registered: Jan. 2006
Posts: 1691

Status: offline
last visit: 28.04.07
What have they got to hide?

On two occasions the government have confirmed that the Welsh and the Irish have Race Relations Act case law that enable them to be included in the Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities, whereas the Cornish, who do not, are being excluded on these grounds.

A request under the Freedom of Information Act to see the documents that support the statements made regarding the Welsh and Irish seems to have the government squirming.

What have they got to hide?

Read the emails sent by the Vice President of F.U.E.N. requesting this information on the CSP website.



1d3az b3c0m3 th0ught5, th0ughtz b3c0m3 1n1t1at1v35, 1n1t1at1v3z b3c0m3 act10n5, act10nz br1ng chang3..
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
Hunlef Posted: 16.03.2007, 11:01

Hunlef

registered: Jul. 2006
Posts: 2092

Status: offline
last visit: 02.01.09
CORNWALL 2000: CIVIL LIBERTIES/HUMAN RIGHTS

Email: mail@cornubian.eclipse.co.uk


Re: The Queen on the application of JOHN ANGARRACK versus SECRETARY OF STATE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT CO/389/2007

Transcript of 10am 15 March 2007 taped telephone conversation between unidentified woman from the High Courts of Justice - Administrative Court [probably Administrative Court Lawyer Joanne Dixon who is supervising the case] and John Angarrack; following Angarrack notifying the Court that he had asked the Attorney General to exercise his powers of intervention under CPR 32.14. The tape can be listened to on request.

CO – Court Official J.A – John Angarrack

J.A: Hello

CO: Can I speak to John Angarrack please.

J.A: Yea, speaking.

CO: Hello I’m phoning from the Administrative Court. I called yesterday but you were not available. Is this a convenient moment to call?

J.A: Yea, sure yea.

CO: Um, I’m phoning because um, because I’ve just received your letter dated 14th March which was brought up to me yesterday which you requested a stay on the matter.

J.A: Yea

CO: Um the case is actually with the single judge at present so um y’know you’ll need to await his decision and update the court as appropriate after the decision has been reached . . .

J.A: Uh! After what decision’s been reached?

CP: On the papers, whether or not to grant permission to apply for judicial review

J.A: Uh….yea…what I want to do is activate the Civil Procedure Rule 32.14.
(Pause)

CO: Well….yea but the fact is its up to the court to pick up to the judge to determine, y’now ‘cos he has the papers and he will determine what is appropriate and what is not appropriate.
(Pause)

J.A: Yea, but y’see its difficult to know when to activate CPR 32.14 because in other cases where there’s been an alleged Contempt of Court the case has been halted while the allegation has been determined.

CO: Yea but this is a Judicial Review matter and there’s been no proceedings begun y’now . . . . .

J.A: There’s been no what?

CO: No actual issue of Contempt proceedings.

J.A: Yea but I want to start Contempt proceedings.

CO: Well they haven’t been issued so therefore the case will proceed as per Judicial Review application.

J.A: Right, the Attorney General under Crown Procedure Rules has the power to intervene . . . .
(Pause)

CO: Well that’s correct, but y’know, contempt proceedings have not been initiated and therefore . . . .

J.A: (interrupt] yea but they haven’t been initiated because the Attorney General has yet to decided whether or not he is going to intervene.

CO: Well as I say, it is a Judicial Review permission application and obviously if the Attorney General . . . . .

J.A: (interrupt) No it’s not, its no longer a judicial review application the dynamics have changed, the other side have submitted papers that amount to a Contempt of Court and I want this Contempt of Court dealt with.
(Pause)

J.A: I don’t want the Judicial Review papers to go before the judge, because they are full of untruths.

CO: The Judge has. . . well you can make representations and they will be forwarded to the judge . . . .

J.A: (interrupt) Well that’s what I’m trying to do. I’m trying to get you at the Administrative Court to notify the judge that there is an application before the Attorney General to get him to intervene in respect of Rule 32.14. Well I don’t see how the judge can go ahead now and determine the case on the papers when we’re awaiting a decision by the Attorney General.

CO: Well, we’ll have to have copies of the correspondence to the Attorney General so it can indicate exactly what status has been reached.

J.A: Right, I will send you today, by fax if you like, the copy of the letter I sent to the Attorney General.

CO: (interrupt] We don’t accept service by fax

J.A: (interrupt) Well you accepted service by fax off me and you’ve accepted service by fax from the Treasury Solicitors before why should things be different now?

CO: It’s only when it’s a question of an emergency.

J.A: Well, all right, I’ll put it in the post today. But this is a legal matter and its no good you ringing me up telling me these things. I need these matters put in writing so I know exactly where I stand. How am I to go to the European Court of Human Rights having exhausted domestic redress procedures in this country when matters like this are handled by the telephone? I must have this conversation put on paper so I know where I stand.
(pause)

CO: I was phoning you as a matter of courtesy urgently immediately I had your letter to put you on notice of the situation.
(pause)

J.A: So the situation now is you’re asking me to forward you the letter I sent to the Attorney General.

CO: That’s right.

J.A: Well I will do that.

END

NOTES:

The background:
Angarrack is taking the UK Gov to court over its refusal to include the Cornish within the Council of Europe framework Convention for the Protection of national Minorities. Although the Secretary of State has submitted her defence to the court, Angarrack has produced, and sent to the Council of Europe, the High Court, the Attorney General and others, an 80 page dossier showing how 23 statements made by the Secretary of State in her defence papers are either false or misleading. The S of S has signed to say all the statements are true.

The law:
CPR 32.14 provides as follows:
Proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against a person if he makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.

Proceedings under this rule may be brought only:


(a) by the Attorney General; or
(b) with the permission of the court.

The context of the above conversation:
The court official was trying to bamboozle Angarrack into allowing the court to proceed with the case, and hence ignore the legitimate CPR 32.14 application to the Attorney General. This was no “courtesy call’. It was an attempt to permit a Contempt of Court to occur unchallenged by deceiving a member of the public into giving up his rights. That is why the Court official telephoned, and not wrote to, Angarrack.

'Condemnation without investigation is ignorance' - Albert Einstein
Top  Profile send PM
 
Hunlef Posted: 16.03.2007, 11:56

Hunlef

registered: Jul. 2006
Posts: 2092

Status: offline
last visit: 02.01.09
This is outrageous, doesn't anyone agree?

'Condemnation without investigation is ignorance' - Albert Einstein
Top  Profile send PM
 
Fulub-le-Breton Posted: 16.03.2007, 13:53

Fulub-le-Breton

registered: Sep. 2004
Posts: 4667

Status: offline
last visit: 09.01.09
Totally agree!!! Is there anything we can do? Letters we can write?

The Cornish Democrat
The Breton Connection
Top  Profile send PM Homepage
 
sentinel Posted: 18.03.2007, 09:33



registered: Aug. 2006
Posts: 835

Status: offline
last visit: 17.11.08
Is there anything we can do? Letters we can write?

Ahh... the inspirational last words of Flamank and AnGof.

Downhill all the way since 1497.
Top  Profile send PM
 
Goto page : Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 Next Page


Users online:
gokyreloaded - morvran - ThingsThatGoFlirInTheShla - Allister

This list bases on the users active in the last 60 minutes
Cornwall24 2006 (c) web design & web hosting by a-connect
Sponsors: Cornwall hotels, Cornwall self-catering, Cornwall restaurant guide,Devon
Cornwall 24 news feed
Cornwall 24 News and Views