I don't know the answers to those questions. I dont assume, like you, that they are lies.
It could be oversight, disinterest.....
I'm not saying they are unrelated, I'm saying history should not be used as a political lever because historical facts are not votes.
We live in a democracy, people should make decisions, not historical facts.
There are many smaller reasons, but this is my core ideological reason.
We will have to just disagree on that point; however I do think the vast majority of people on the planet would not consider what happened in Cornwall the same as what has happened in many places across time and land.
There are many forces outside of Cornwall that are influencing Cornwall, just as every region, this is the nature of global change. People are moving around more. Overpopulation in Africa is going to Force more people in Europe. Economic benefits will cause more migrants from the East to the West of Europe. And Cornwall will not be spared of this change.
It is a tide that cant be stopped, loath it or look forward to it, its inevitable. You simply cannot disagree with that I feel, not while being rational.
Its not. Long may it be told. What damaging is when that becomes the only issue of importance politically.
They are the extremes, there is much in between (And I dont think Im very Diplomatic or you at all Thuggish )
I think its a moral, legal and educational aim, not a political aim. A political aim would be, for example, increasing average wage in Cornwall's most deprived areas.
Jim, you say you don't call it a Conspiracy but the terms you use here suggest it is a sophisticated and deviant collaboration between TEAM-EIA (Whats the EIS? English ....?) is paramount to saying here is a Conspiracy.
I have to this day not seen one jot of written evidence for a Modern Conspiacy, say, in the last ten years. So, is there evidence? Is it still not a conspiracy?
Thanks
Mat
Freako Mbiko
Please Visit the Wonderful Continent of Kernow and, after that, check out my blogs:
If there is an initial lie, however long ago, and decisions and statements made on the basis of that lie are still adhered to, however well intentioned, even after that original lie has been pointed out, what does that make those decisions and statements?
True, but decisions should be made based on the facts, all of them.
As I have said before, an atrocity is still an atrocity, a murder a murder, it matters not when, or by whom, it was perpetrated. To start "awarding" levels of disgust or reprehensibility to such events is an insult to the memory of those who suffered, and suffer still, because of them. They are either all wrong, and equally reprehensible, or we start opening the door to allow them to be excused, "it was only a few thousand people, and it was a long time ago, and it contributed to what we have today, so it wasn't that bad". That is a dangerous road to go down.
There are those, who today, deny the holocaust, some who dispute the numbers who died, there are even those who try to justify it. In a few hundred years time, will it be looked on in the way you look upon the treatment of the Cornish? or do you believe it should still be looked on as the disgusting episode it was.
Whilst at the moment it can not be stopped, it is possible to manage it, and reduce the worse effects of it, it is, in part, what the FCPNM, and the inclusion of the Cornish within it, is designed to do.
However, looking to the future, with the increasing cost of fuel, and the green lobby regarding transportation, etc, it could be argued that in 20 years or so such immigration will reduce to a trickle. Remember, tides go out as well as in.
Everything is political, you can not remove a subject from the political arena just because you feel it to be damaging, or irelevent. That is the road to censorship, which I hope we can agree on as being a road that should not be trod.
The historical issues regarding Cornwall are not the only issue of political importance, there are many. However, all issues should be looked on, and dealt with, with the historical issues in mind. For without our history, we are as the English establishment would have you believe, without our history we are lost. It is our history that marks us different. It is the difference of different groups of people that make us special, and it is that difference that needs to be preserved. Without it, we will end up as one enormous homogeneous people, with one uniform culture, probably a mix of American and Chinese. That is not the way I would want to live, nor do I suspect do you.
How can you divorce the law and education from politics?
The law is how political decisions are administrated, and education, amongst other things, is how a state prepares its new members, its children, to be part of that state, to be "good" citisens/subjects. With all due respect, it is very naive to think that such things are not political.
You keep asking for evidence, but I am not sure what evidence would be acceptable to you. The thing is that it is not a "Modern Conspiracy", it is a very old one, one that has had time to bury as much evidence of its existence as it can. The real conspiracy now, is the one that is denying the possibility of the original ones existence, the one that refuses to allow any independent investigation into the issues.
The evidence today is fragmentary, a little bit here, and a little bit there. Each little bit on its own may well not be enough to be looked on as evidence, but when collected together, and looked on as a whole, is glaringly obvious. What evidence do you have to contradict it?
Kernow Kensa!
Our day will come!
"Everyone has their own particular part to play. No part is too great or too small, no one is too old or too young to do something."
The answer is: within the past ten to twenty one years. There has been enough said about this on C24 to rule out ‘oversight’ and ‘disinterest’, so what else is left?
I must confess to not having a clue as to what the first comment means in practical terms. The second comment also begs definition because decisions need to be based on knowledge and knowledge is, I believe, truth. If you believe that it is a democracy, then the Cornish should also be entitled to feel a part of it.
What is happening to the Cornish has its parallels to a greater or lesser degree all over the planet. Given a free vote on the issues, I would suggest that you would certainly be surprised. It would certainly be true within Europe. It is a subject that needs to be studied.
Not sure why you think this response is relevant to what is being discussed, or why you should feel inclined to believe that the Cornish should be disadvantaged in a way that others are not? Surely it suggests an even stronger reason why Cornish recognition within its own administrative framework should now be a matter of some urgency?
Once again, I cannot understand the logic of this. Who suggests that it is the only issue of importance – politically, or otherwise? For the Cornish Future it is fundamental, along with many other aspect of life.
But it needs a political solution, so it must be a political aim also. A consideration of the first part of my quoted point would also be most welcome.
I have no hesitation in making a judgement that the lies can only occur because of collusion at the top, with devastating consequences for the Cornish. This is provable but they are, at the moment, ‘untouchable’. I also have no hesitation in referring to what is being done to the Cornish as ‘genocide’, because of the processes at work against us. I also have no hesitation in pointing the finger of culpability at the inertia of English Imperialism initiated by an English Hegemony and driven wittingly, or unwittingly, by members of TEAM-EIS (EIS=English Imperial State). I have neither need, nor desire, to identify it as a conspiracy because the evidence for the others, imho, is overwhelming and, having read a bit about conspiracies, it seems impossible to prove one ever exists. It would be easy to say that it is, but why take the difficult option?
The existence of divergent views occur because the lies and deception have a more profoundly negative, and contrived, consequence for the Cornish people than for anyone else within this island.
That depends on the knowledge and intention of the people continuing the state of affairs in question.
I still have not seen any evidence that there is a modern deception, just the assumption that there is.
That's just wrong. It does matter when. A millennium old murder, say of the alpine ice man discovered a few years ago, is just not the same as the murder of someone today.
Please don't misrepresent me. I have consistently maintained this should not be forgotten and now more than ever think it should be taught.
However, the terrible behavior of one man (or more?) ordering the hiring German mercenaries to kill Cornish "gentlemen" is and was wrong. Lets agree to disagree on the fact that you think this is comparable in atrociousness to the Holocaust of the Jews or the Tutsis
We will never find level ground there, I feel
How can this be managed? And not on paper, on the ground... how? Checkpoints at the Tamar?
"Papers Please!" in pasty patisseries?
That statements, I feel, is very much removed from reality. Check out the way the population has rocketed in the last 50 years, that spike in the grap, that keeps going up, is not looking like a tide that can turn.
I think politics is about future, sure its influenced by the past, but its concern is the future.
"we will end up as one enormous homogeneous people"
Yep, its inevitable. You will not find one case in history, apart from isolationist totalitarian states like N Korea, where this trend has not happened. Its pretty much a universal law that populations mix and change and interdilute. Much like milk in your coffee.
"That is not the way I would want to live, nor do I suspect do you."
Nope, its not.
The kind of evidence would be a document or testimony alleging that 2 or more people from the English establishment have engaged in a deception or coercion for the better gains of England over Cornwall.
Its very clear now there is no such evidence. Lest not that can be presented after multiple requests on here
I would be happy with fragments and little bits. But I suspect there are none because were there, they would be all over this forum, at least.
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
I am not saying I KNOW that its not a conspiracy, maybe it is. I'm saying I will remain skeptical until I have seen evidence evidence.
This is the correct method with any conspiracy. To not follow it is the difference between a conspiracy theorist/researcher and a conspiracy fantasist.
Mat
Freako Mbiko
Please Visit the Wonderful Continent of Kernow and, after that, check out my blogs:
Again, I haven't seen any evidence for this, juts the assumption of establishment guilt.
Nobody, but nobody, seems to be able to provide any items that suggest a contemporary "conspiracy". And I have asked now many times.
And I wont give up, if you accuse A of doing X I think I am justified in asking for the evidence of this
Well, by a "political lever" I mean to use a historical fact to get some political change. In the Case of Cornwall it would be to get more autonomy for Cornwall by convincing the English establishment that its rightfully not part of England.
My lord, that would be great if that could happen. But it will never happen for many reasons just as it has never happened before, apart from maybe the Creation of Israel? I'm not sure.
Sure, study it. Tell everyone. Teach it. Im not saying its not an important issue for Cornwall, Im saying it should be kept out of the political arena.
But, lets agree to disagree on that
Yes! But I see the two as ultimately unconnected. One is achieved through the pressure and legal wrangling and the other through constituencies voting.
This is the same argument David Ike uses for his reptilian conspiracies (which he seems to have more evidence for than the Cornish conspiracy), that the conspiracy is so entrenched and the conspirators so powerful, they cannot be shown.
You may have no hesitation, equally, you have no evidence it seems. If your happy with that, I guess thats that.
I think its best we don't discuss the conspiratorial nature of this because I just wont accept your methods without evidence, in the same way as if you told me we didn't go to the moon.
Mat
Freako Mbiko
Please Visit the Wonderful Continent of Kernow and, after that, check out my blogs:
Did you purposely wait for the new JA book to come out before deciding to make a complete tit of yourself on this forum?
JA's new book and website is the result of years of investigation into the Duchy and its corruption of the truth about Cornwall together with documented and referenced proof and then you come out with....
For the first time ever a single website link is locked onto the front page of C24 offering all the proof you need and you can't even understand what its about.
You are asking for something you have every right to ask for, and please don't accuse me of duplicity ("and you know it"), I'm never like that
England never conquered Cornwall, it subsumed it over many years.
I guess my ideas are kinda novel. That doesn't make them wrong or against yours
I suspect some people here think I'm an English spy or trouble maker bla bla bla (I got that accusation last week... or was it Lib Dem spy?)... but if you see what I am saying, I agree with most sentiments here.
I really believe that is the case. But I believe the only way to control is via democracy, not law. You seem to believe that legally you can get this victory. I can see now way how, nor can i see any comparable historical case of success
AND HERE IS THE CRUX
I agree with you! England doesnt give a flying youknowwhat about Cornwall...
The legal time and fees, civil servants time, politicians time... etc etc etc... its just not worth the hassle to even open the debate on it.
I have to point out that saying "England does not give a s**t about Cornwall or the Cornish." is not then consistant with saying, as many others do (including you) here, that there is interest and conspiracy.
Either there is a machivellian conpiracy thats lasted decades or, "England does not give a s**t about Cornwall or the Cornish."
I dont see both can be true
Mat
or Devon... Or Shropshire.
[/quote][/quote]
Freako Mbiko
Please Visit the Wonderful Continent of Kernow and, after that, check out my blogs:
You're the only one that insists on calling it a conspiracy, to the rest of us it is blatantly obvious what is going on.
JA's site and book contains all the proof you need to understand the bigger picture. Unfortunately your head does not seem capable of grasping much of it at all.
The Cornish movement as a whole would benefit if you never posted here again.
As have others throughout the forum Search for "conspiracy"
I tell you what Moonshine, lets strike a deal, as you clearly want me away from here, and I clearly find you an immature troll who, unlike many, adds nothing to the debates here.
So.....
If you can paste two bits of this evidence that you are so sure is on JA's site or in his book that pertains to English government's "evil" machinations/conspiracy and if that evidence/information is within the last decade, I'll leave the forum.
And if you cant find it then you have to just promise to ignore me on here
Deal?
Freako Mbiko
Please Visit the Wonderful Continent of Kernow and, after that, check out my blogs:
"There can be no doubt that in Britain today, the Cornish people’s territory and status are being altered/downgraded without their knowledge or approval. This covert process, moving inexorably towards the final assimilation of the Cornish population, can only be achieved by the following conditions being accepted, encouraged and rewarded by the state: (1) A selectively applied breakdown of moral and ethical standards leading to institutionalised administrative dishonesty and governmental law-breaking, (2) Comprehensive historical revisionism and the misapplication of due cultural funding coupled with the wholesale misappropriation of Cornish cultural heritage, built environment and intellectual property. At the vanguard of this process is an educationally-driven policy of forced assimilation supported by across-the-board political acquiescence and high level judicial complicity. However, no directive to this effect will be found.
After centuries of working to an imperialist agenda, the Westminster elite are fully adept at carrying out politically sensitive, but necessarily unwritten, colonial policy. Therefore absence of a written directive does not mean that any particular policy is not being applied. For like a Black Hole in space, these integrated policies and working practices are shown to be in existence not by any written directive, but by the results they produce. Therefore let the reader be under no illusion. The UK Government’s 21st century response to the centuries old ‘Cornish Question’ is to covertly instigate, and firmly apply, a comprehensive programme of de-Cornishification.
When a state becomes locked into an imperial mindset, a number of interlinking and complimentary initiatives are required to achieve the overall objective. For example, there is the need to render the victim territory politically impotent, to starve the separate and competing culture of funding, to place tight control on what information is available to children in school, to render the native population statistically invisible, to stigmatise human rights activity as ‘dangerous’, to exclude the native population from the safeguards available via the application of international legal treaties and then to banish them to a legal no-mans-land if they complain. On top of this, in order to maintain the constitutional deception and status disentitlement, there is the absolute requirement to create and disseminate a new history of the people and territory they inhabit - one that states, suggests or implies by omission that the territory being subsumed has been an integral part of the expanding and consolidating state since time immemorial. "
1) that he's Cornish. A classic attempt to dismiss those with legitimate aims and aspirations. He's Cornish you fools, so he MUST be right!
2) (and this is the jewel of the crown) that we live in a democracy!
Despite the copious references to the lack of a written constitutional text to protect 'subjects' from abuse of power by the state, the absence of a constitutional/statutory guarantee of the principle of equality before the law (cf Amendment 14 of the US Constitution), the failure by the state to include Article 13 of the ECHR in its Human Rights Act 1998, the failure by the state to ratify Protocol 12 of the ECHR, the failure by the state to incorporate European Directive 2000/43/EC into domestic legislation by the hopelessly inadequate Statutory Instrument 1626, the retention of an unelected head of state and associated upper chamber of parliament, the retention of an wholly archaic and undemocratic Privy Council......
I could go on and on...
and all the Freak can do is squeal that we are a democracy!! In the light of the above exposure, we would all do well to ignore this ar$hole. He's a complete pseudo-intellectual 'idiot'!
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(And I dont think Im very Diplomatic or you at all Thuggish 
)
