Removal of the English Flag - St Austell

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Grum
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Post by Grum » Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:28 pm

I think it is Great Britain, but that sounds a bit overbearing. I dunno.

Fulub-le-Breton
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Post by Fulub-le-Breton » Sun Apr 15, 2007 3:00 pm

Great Britain is the big island.

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Post by Frenchie » Sun Apr 15, 2007 3:01 pm


grum said:
I think it is Great Britain, but that sounds a bit overbearing. I dunno.



Does it? Take the Great off it, see if you feel less 'over-beared' when you say it.

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TGG
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Post by TGG » Sun Apr 15, 2007 8:06 pm


Coady - Posted: 15.04.2007, 14:18 said:

[size=small]FLB, Grum, Thats the problem, "UK, British Isles or Great Britain" also include the Scillies and the Channel Isles, where there are shops further south the the Lizard.

It was that that led to me contemplating what our biggest Island (with Scotland, Cornwall Wales and England on it) should be called?[/size]



Visit here to distinguish between political and geographical, and there is no problem in simply using Great Britain, or its colloquial equivalent 'Britain'!

The 'Great' is now an anachronism because it was - apparently? - a transient means of differentiating it from 'Little Britain' (Brittany) and nothing to do with some self-righteous concept of greatness.

TGG
STOP THE CORNISH GENOCIDE! -
They declare their Cornishness with pride
Whilst oblivious to our genocide
That England imposes
With smiles and Red Roses
Where the innocents, so gullibly, reside.


Grum
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Post by Grum » Sun Apr 15, 2007 9:38 pm

Cheers for clearing that up TGG - I did an image search but there were some ambiguous results as it seems many people are unsure of what's what.

Mind you, some people think the entire island is called England :lol:



edited by: grum, Apr 15, 2007 - 09:40 PM

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TGG
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Post by TGG » Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:30 pm


grum - Posted: 15.04.2007, 21:38 said:
Mind you, some people think the entire island is called England :lol:


Thanks due to Shakespeare - and the continuing official failure(!) to have any meaningful protocols to differentiating between a Government based in London, GB and the London as the capital city of England! :-x

This is not helped by the many mnemonic versions of television advertising which rely on the subliminal message contained within the 'Sceptred Isle' speech. Interesting, indeed, that the latest (and current) version ends up by an aerial smoke display in the Cornish colours of White, Black and Gold! ;-)

TGG

link to Shakespeare quote added 16/04/2007



edited by: TGG, Apr 16, 2007 - 09:20 PM
STOP THE CORNISH GENOCIDE! -
They declare their Cornishness with pride
Whilst oblivious to our genocide
That England imposes
With smiles and Red Roses
Where the innocents, so gullibly, reside.


Grum
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Post by Grum » Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:53 pm

Aaaaahh, that was Bruno's excuse - too much Romeo and Juliette before bedtime :lol:

I loathe Shakespeare - he was just the Spielburg of his time, it's out of date now and boring.

Dunno what advert that is - I avoid most TV where possible, but Gwen Stefani's new video is those colours!

Coincidence, or marketing dream... ;-)

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TGG
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Post by TGG » Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:35 am

You could be right about Shakespeare but he has had a very profound effect on how history has been perceived.

I cannot remember what the current advert was/is about - certainly nothing very edifying. I just picked up on the narration and sat waiting for the inevitable punchline that never came! Previous usage includes 'Keeping Britain Tidy' and Typhoo 'putting the T in Britain.

GS video is certainly very enriching and illustrates well, what a magnificent colour combination the Cornish colours are :-)

TGG
STOP THE CORNISH GENOCIDE! -
They declare their Cornishness with pride
Whilst oblivious to our genocide
That England imposes
With smiles and Red Roses
Where the innocents, so gullibly, reside.


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Coady
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Post by Coady » Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:06 am

Grum, I am surprised!

Shakespeare was so outstanding of his time that he stunned, and still stuns academics and students of literature.

We had no-one in the 20th Century, and no-one yet in this century who was so astoundingly better than his/her peers.

Even people in other countries who love and revere their own philosophers, poets and playwrights make room for admiration of the breadth and depth of Shakespeare's skills!

Spielberg doesn't even scratch the surface.
We live in interesting times!

Grum
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Post by Grum » Mon Apr 16, 2007 10:42 am

Meh, has never grabbed me with anything remotely approaching interest, but then I'm not a fan of old stuff generally.

Still, to each their own, I just wish I wasn't force fed quite so much of it at school.

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Coady
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Post by Coady » Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:21 pm

We ought to have had a Cornish equivalent to Shakespeare somewhere around the 1600s, that might have kept the language going longer, fired people up to hang on to it....
We live in interesting times!

Hunlef
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Post by Hunlef » Tue Apr 17, 2007 9:25 am


Coady said:
We ought to have had a Cornish equivalent to Shakespeare somewhere around the 1600s, that might have kept the language going longer, fired people up to hang on to it....



We probably had such a character, or a number of them, living quietly and productively at the college of Glasney until the English tyrant Henry VIII put a brutal end to that enterprise some fifty years prior to your suggested date.

Instead, we had one or two 'Uncle Tom' Cornish (you know what that means, Coady?), like Richard Carew of Antonie who, in 1605, added his "Epistle concerning the Excellencies of the English Tongue" to his otherwise useful "Survey of Cornwall", a work that clearly did little to protect our Cornish language.



edited by: Hunlef, Apr 17, 2007 - 08:33 AM

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Coady
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Post by Coady » Tue Apr 17, 2007 10:39 am

(Sigh.. can never resist cheapening a contribution with a personal jibe, can you Hun!)

I've no doubt that Glasney had, or could have produced quality scholars of every type, there may well have been outstanding work destroyed, or lost over time, but Glasney College was part of the Roman Catholic Church in Britain, and had any of the scholars tried to produce anything with the bawdiness, irreverence and challenging content of Shakespeare, the College authorities would have stamped on them quick enough!

Any such person would have had to strike out on their own and go to London like Shakespeare did!.

What happened to Glasney College was not particular to Cornwall or Cornish issues. There were church colleges all up and down the British Isles, and the vast majority of them suffered the same fate of destruction, even physical obliteration, as the admittedly harsh Henry VIII forced the cataclysmic ripping of Britain away from the Roman Catholic Church.

...A modern equivalent would be something like splitting from the European Union, executing, torturing or persecuting all pro European UK supporters, and deporting or killing all EU citizens in Britain...and THEN embarking on a Foreign policy that contributed to hundreds of years of conflict with various European states.

What Henry VIII did was at least that extreme.

We can only speculate as to what Europe,the UK and Cornwall would have been like today if they had stayed Catholic, and whether on balance it would have been better, or worse.

One thing though, if the Catholic Church had allowed Glasney to continue creating and recording works in Cornish, the language might not have faded as badly as it did, and there would at least have been a whole body of literature that would have made resurrection of the language a far simpler matter.

Tch! We're MADLY off topic now!
We live in interesting times!

Jack33
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Post by Jack33 » Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:56 pm


Tch! We're MADLY off topic now!




Sorry but I'm just going a bit further off topic

I cannot say anything about the poetic word play in Cornish Liturgic drama as my Cornish is particularly limited but my little reading in English of what is left of the Cornish scripts written for the Plens across Cornwall leads me to think they were often heavily politicised, littered with in jokes and bawdy action and definatly playing to the crowd.

Bwunans Meriasic is a great example of a drama with a plot that careers around the place, with special effects, pyrotechnics and a lot of anti establishment material.

King Arthur reads like a Hollywood spectacular, until the pages run out of course...

I admit it is not Shakespeare but the dramatic form and staging are essentially native to Cornwall and in many ways cannot be compared to other British Drama because what we have is unique(York and Wakefield have versions of Medieval Drama but the staging is significantly different and the plays address the subject matter in a different way). We have a series of dramas handed down to us that make up a huge portion of the written Cornish we have left from this era.

We can only wonder what might of happened if the Bible had actually been translated into Cornish but the play writers of Cornwall managed to save most of a language for us and that is more than Shakespeare and his blatent copying of imported Italian drama ever did.

I am a fan of Shakespeare on the whole but the dramatic archaology in Cornwall is one of our great untapped resources, we still have the origional theatres from the sixteenth centuary, how many places can say that?

And I am very glad that flag came down, I always imagined you would get a great view from up there.

jack33

PS apologies for poor spelling, this mouse is playing up as is my dyslexia

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Marhak
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Post by Marhak » Tue Apr 17, 2007 7:14 pm

Hunlef, Carew was descended from the Carew family of Devon (Sir Gawen and Sir Peter Carew were prominent for the enemy in 1549) who were given illegally confiscated lands in Cornwall. No wonder then that he was so adept and willing to undermine the Cornish.

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