Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Topical debate
zennorman2
Posts: 375
Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2010 12:50 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by zennorman2 » Tue May 22, 2012 9:14 pm

Capten and Marhak make some good points but Milliband appears to be a different proposition to Blair. While Iraq and the south west region were disgraceful those things are now gone (although the south west region is ever lurking). Split votes lead to Tory and Liberal MPs. People are really suffering. Even if they loose their jobs there are no benefits. My heart says vote MK in Council elections and (as much as the local Labour people dont understand Cornwall) my head says vote for them to get rid of the right wingers.

User avatar
capten
Posts: 93
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:55 pm
Location: Orth ros ow gorhel

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by capten » Wed May 23, 2012 10:01 am

As we saw during the last election, voting one party in order to get another out does not always end up with the desired outcome. People voted Lib Dem to get the Tories out, and now they're in bed together! With hindsight we can see that the Lib Dems are just Tory-lite but before the election that wasn't the case.

Labour are not a social democratic saviour, they are centrists just like the Lib Dems. They will still favour business over individuals, still make cuts, still increase tuition fees, still kowtow to the IMF and neo-liberalism, still increase the cost of living for average people and still creep in top-down regionalisation as part of their core philosophy of centrally-controlled social democracy. As for Miliband - different puppet, same masters.

Tactical voting is damaging to democracy and does nothing but disadvantage smaller parties while maintaining the cyclic nature of mainstream power. Vote for the party you want - it's the only way that a true reflection of the political opinion of the country can be sent to the higher ups.

This is just one example of the disingenuity of the Labour Party:


Rosko
Posts: 587
Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:45 am

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by Rosko » Wed May 23, 2012 2:44 pm

Tean,

Where I completely agree with you re. our national sport, I have to take issue with some of your other points.

The project initially involved that bankrupt crook, Kevin Heany, and no doubt he still harbours plans to use any new stadium to move TCFC out of its current ground, so he can swindle a few more people by redeveloping the Treyew Road site.

I'd be interested to see the official (usually slightly) inflated figures for match attendances at both TCFC AND Pirates RFC, in recent years. I went to most games during their Kenwyn year, and also watched many games, when located in Camborne. I'm not sure where you get your figures from, but the most popular fixtures - real one-offs - would be announced at 3-4000, over the tannoy system.

The reason I'm against the stadium in its current form is two fold. The first reason is panning out just as expected. That the whole stadium plan was always a side issue for a developer to build a new town for everyone and their dog, bar most Cornish people. Probably similar project to the Bodmin experiment, many years ago, and to the proposed Manchester-St. Austell tie up coming round the corner, fast...
The second is that the whole location issue was COMPLETELY WRONG. You don't put a brand new national stadium in a narrow traffic jam corridor, right in the middle of current and just agreed housing estates, surely?!!

If it's really a stadium for Cornwall, it shouldn't matter where it goes, so you aim for transport links, so for me, Bodmin or Re'Druth/Camborne were the ideal and obvious choices. Truro was picked because that's where the housing developments are easily passed, where the developers get the best prices, and so the whole thing was another gravy train exercise.

Plus, in these times of hardship for many, using council money when front line services are being cut everywhere, and jobs lost, is hardly appropriate, I would have thought.

Dickie Evans bluffed everyone, went off in a huff, back to Penzance. But now he's jumping up and down, like an angry 2-year old not getting his toy. Let him and crook-Heany (with his Russian money) finance the bloody thing... Somewhere logical AND HONEST (no hidden housing agendas).

Just look at where they built the Chiefs' stadium, for God's sakes, right next to the M5 and airport....

Rosko
Posts: 587
Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:45 am

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by Rosko » Wed May 23, 2012 4:46 pm

PS and for all those that thought (or think) that they were building a stadium for Cornwall, think again.

For the Pirates to be promoted, they needed this stadium, but also with primacy of use, according to Premiership rules, so we were effectively agreeing to building a new stadium for the Pirates (for Dickie), with an understanding that others could borrow it too, when not busy. No wonder he agreed to pay for running costs for a few years!! He was getting a brand new stadium practically for free... No wonder he's jumping, as he's now gonna have to build one himself, hopefully where it belongs, in Penzance. Tell me again Tean, what average crowds number at current games?
The whole development question in and around Truro just stinks of corruption all the way. Councillors Varney, Pascoe et al are no better than Jack Harvey...

zennorman2
Posts: 375
Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2010 12:50 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by zennorman2 » Wed May 23, 2012 9:25 pm

capten wrote:As we saw during the last election, voting one party in order to get another out does not always end up with the desired outcome. People voted Lib Dem to get the Tories out, and now they're in bed together! With hindsight we can see that the Lib Dems are just Tory-lite but before the election that wasn't the case.

Labour are not a social democratic saviour, they are centrists just like the Lib Dems. They will still favour business over individuals, still make cuts, still increase tuition fees, still kowtow to the IMF and neo-liberalism, still increase the cost of living for average people and still creep in top-down regionalisation as part of their core philosophy of centrally-controlled social democracy. As for Miliband - different puppet, same masters.

Tactical voting is damaging to democracy and does nothing but disadvantage smaller parties while maintaining the cyclic nature of mainstream power. Vote for the party you want - it's the only way that a true reflection of the political opinion of the country can be sent to the higher ups.
I think where the Liberals and Clegg were going could be rumbled by a thinking voter before the last election. Thats why I voted MK.

User avatar
GrahamHart
Posts: 2084
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 8:26 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by GrahamHart » Thu May 24, 2012 12:44 am

With hindsight we can see that the Lib Dems are just Tory-lite but before the election that wasn't the case.

To you.....and sadly, the vast majority. Maybe at last, people are beginning to see they are all just a different coloured neck tie working for the ruling elite of banksters and rotten corrupt corporations :)
I think where the Liberals and Clegg were going could be rumbled by a thinking voter before the last election.
I wait with baited breath for a thinking voter, yet alone a critical mass capable of critical thinking :(

roy999
Posts: 18
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:43 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by roy999 » Fri May 25, 2012 2:25 pm

I completely agree with you Rosko on the issuse of the stadium.
And as for feedback on the MK website a little boring and predictable.

tean
Posts: 68
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:58 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by tean » Fri May 25, 2012 7:28 pm

rosko,

I'm not going to get into a protracted argument so I will put my point of view here once more and if you disagree then we will have to agree to disagree.

It was the council who, at considerable expense, commissioned professional consultants Gardiner and Theobald to make an initial feasibility study, site assessment and market appraisal for a sports stadium in Cornwall. This initial study assessed twenty seven sites across Cornwall and they identified a site at Langarth Farm, Threemilestone as the site with the best potential for the development of a stadium.

Truro is our capital city and is in the best situation to receive fans from all over the Duchy not those just from the West. You would be surprised to know just how many fans Pirates have who hail from all over Cornwall. The year at Kenwyn proved that as we had average crowds of over three thousand that season. Before you mock that figure consider that Exeter Chiefs had less than that at the County Ground, it was only when they moved to Sandy Park that their crowds increased. If Premiership rugby were to come here then a 10,000 seat stadium might prove to be inadequate which is why the proposed stadium will have the capability to increase to 12,500 eventually. Sale and Worcester did not have big crowds prior to playing in big stadiums. Hell we had 4500 at Camborne for a friendly against Leicester Tigers.

Now I will admit that, as a Penwithian I usually do not go to Truro that often so I do not experience the rush hour peak traffic. However I have had occasion during the last month to have to make three visits to the RCH and one to County Hall.
The visit to County Hall was puzzling to me because I was at Chiverton Cross at 9-10am and, apart from a little bit of traffic between the College and hospital I reached Truro City FC at 9.30 am. Where were all these massive traffic jams the anti stadium people keep referring to? My visits to the RCH were for appts at 11am, 12-45 pm and 3pm. From Chiverton Cross to the park and ride I encountered hardly any traffic at all. Now I mention that because the Pirates will play their games on a Sunday so the traffic should be minimal, as it was when Pirates were at Kenwyn on a Sunday. There are rail links to Truro and an airport at Newquay which is not a million miles away. If you've ever been to a Premiership match at Kingsholme or Franklins Gardens you would see they seem to manage with traffic and they are both right in the cities, the proposed Cornwall stadium is on the outskirts.

Anyway on Wednesday night I learnt that the issue is not all over as quite a few councillors realise that they should have voted to at least see the Stadium consortium's business plans before coming to a decision so that decision may well be overturned by the Cabinet.

I leave you with comment from one of our greatest rugby players.

http://www.espnscrum.com/england/rugby/ ... 64461.html

User avatar
Marhak
Posts: 11075
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:46 am

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by Marhak » Sat May 26, 2012 1:30 pm

If the stadium's ever built, and if the planning committee councillors carry on as they are, then it won't be on the "outskirts" for very long. Cornwall doesn't need a stadium for just the Pirates and maybe Truro City. It needs an all-purpose stadium for many more sports, athletics included.

Rosko
Posts: 587
Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:45 am

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by Rosko » Sun May 27, 2012 9:24 pm

Tean,

I agree with you and our venerable Phil V. on so many points, but take massive issue on the choice of site, and stand by what I've said.
The decision to build there was linked primarily to shady deals with developers, and the ongoing gross over-development of Truro, driven by top house prices in the area, thanks to huge demand by city baby-boomers looking for a piece of little England, after the destruction of their own 'environment', which itself has become blighted by over-development, crime, noise, traffic, immigration, an extra runway or two, health & safety (as though this was somehow more 'lenient' in Cornwall!), relatively lower house prices, lower population density, childhood nostalgia, etc, etc...

As for your recent trips to Treliske, you've either been incredibly fortunate or, I don't know... But I live and worked in and around Truro most of my life (I spent 7 years at Univ. in the shires), so can tell you that traffic levels, especially around the proposed site at Langarth (close to where I work at Penstraze) are frightening.

What people tend to forget, is that, as well as crawling traffic heading back and forth to the A30 at Chiverton, for much of rush hour, morning and night, all the smaller and more dangerous rat runs, are fast filling up too. Roads which until 10-15 years ago, you'd ave been lucky to cross a tractor on, eg Penweathers, Chacewater to Carnon Downs, to Bissoe, to Perranwell, Quenchwell, Frogpool, Wheal Jane, Cusgarne, Baldhu are now all constantly subjected to fast and furious traffic by motorists trying to avoid the big delays on the main thoroughfares in and out of Truro. Hence so many accidents on these, including the two relatively recent fatalities on the Carnon Downs Bissoe cross roads.

You Penwithians have still got it relatively easy traffic-wise. I can tell you now, traffic in and around Truro, as well as in Falmouth & Penryn (St Austell's been bad for longer), has become a nightmare in a very, very short space of time.

CJenkin
Posts: 1332
Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2005 1:01 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by CJenkin » Mon May 28, 2012 12:14 pm

Tean's points still stand though - the road system has plenty of capacity here off peak. In a ten thousand seater stadium your not going to have more than 5000 traffic movements (probably less with people using public transport) when you think that at present during peak periods there are 14000 traffic movements daily. The stadium will have limited impact on the traffic.
The housing development and planning officials are another matter - many, many councillors are concerned about the lack of transparency between the council and developers across the whole of Truro not just this site. For example, I'm more upset about the Tresillian development which will cause many more problems on the opposite side of Truro.
If this development goes ahead which now seems likely then we should at least try to get a community sports stadium out of it.
I know Truro College will make great use of the facilities that will be there and will do things like host community events at the stadium.
Readers maybe interested to know that the college Rugby team has for the second year reached the WORLD final of college teams unfortunately losing to a New Zealand College (no surprise there) - wouldn't it be great if the world competition could be hosted in Cornwall?

CJenkin
Posts: 1332
Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2005 1:01 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by CJenkin » Mon May 28, 2012 12:20 pm

On the general points about growth MK councillors have been working hard to try and reduce the growth levels that Cornwall Council will implement - it has to be said we are up against it though and we will be seeing lots of developments coming forward in the future that people will be outraged by - I'm not convinced this one is the worst but I share Rosko's concerns and fears for the future.
I'll give you one position that planners have taken that I fundamentally disagree with. They believe that if Truro increases its housing capacity then there will be a reduction in the numbers of people commuting. Its positions like these which are driving the requirement for excessive green-field development.

tean
Posts: 68
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:58 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by tean » Mon May 28, 2012 4:58 pm

rosko,

You can rest easy about the Stadium as it looks like that project is heading for the rocks. The housing thing is a different kettle of fish because there may be more houses than planned if they use the land that was earmarked for the Stadium.

I accept your points about the Truro traffic as you live there and I don't, however I must point out that I do not lie and on the days I mentioned the traffic was light. I think the park and ride at 3Milestone helps enormously though.

User avatar
Coady
Posts: 2734
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 4:12 pm
Location: Hayle

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by Coady » Mon May 28, 2012 5:28 pm

For me, it's a matter of concern that Conan says MK is "working hard to try and reduce the growth levels that Cornwall Council will implement"

As far as I can see it is not with any wicked intent that Cornwall Council have set provisional future levels, BUT they have quite properly looked at projected figures for inward migration and natural growth of the existing population and have consulted local town and parish councils for their views and opinions based on their experience of their own areas.

As you know, "failing to plan is planning to fail".....

I know many people would like it to be possible to keep things as they are, to restrict inward migration, and just build enough homes to satisfy current needs, but there are no lawful powers to make that possible, even members of all the other European Union nations have the right to come and settle here if they want, not just people from England.

Cornwall is the victim of its own attractiveness as a location to move to, to live in and to enjoy. Failure to plan for the provision of appropriate housing will mean meteoric house price rises beyond current levels (Look at the recent history of Scilly's Silly prices)

Add to this the Coalition's new Planning Regime, where there is a presumption IN FAVOUR of "sustainable development" and I fear MK might well end up flogging a dead horse by adopting a position of opposition, and MIGHT be better off embracing the inevitable and working instead to get the best balance of appropriate new housing and development for the benefit of the existing population and looking to connect the provision of employment to levels of housing.

Graham.
We live in interesting times!

Trevorpen
Posts: 640
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2007 9:44 pm

Re: Mebyon Kernow feedback wanted

Post by Trevorpen » Mon May 28, 2012 6:26 pm

Absolutely correct there Coady. Growth levels need to increase right across the spectrum. If this doesn't happen property prices will carry on increasing above the national average, investment in the county will be restricted, therefore Cornish graduates will carry on leaving the county, only to be replaced by an increasing retirement sector more dependent on public services from the council.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests