"Jowal Lethesow" dyllys in Kernowek

A new forum dedicated to Kernewek - the Cornish language, Cornish culture and the history of the Duchy of Cornwall
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Anselm
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Post by Anselm » Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:43 pm

Karesk said:
Mes unver ov vy. Cortes a via usya hanow a wra dewis nebonen y honen.


Da lowr. Rag henna, yn le 'Nynja', y fydh res dhyn leverel 'Chyfrewler oll y'n pow ma'.
Anselm

'Against a promontory my ship' Rump L. Stiltz-Kinn

'With regret I feel that unless you have a serious change of heart your presence at the Mennaye on Cornish Pirates match days is no longer desired.'
Rod Coward
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Cornish Pirates

pietercharles
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Post by pietercharles » Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:50 pm

Karesk said:
Cortes a via usya hanow a wra dewis nebonen y honen.


'Chons tew' dell leverir yn Sowsnek! 

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Marhak
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Post by Marhak » Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:47 pm

Don't be silly, Keith - it's not a insult, it's a nickname - take a look at your own avatar!

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Anselm
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Post by Anselm » Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:08 pm

pietercharles said:
Karesk said:
Cortes a via usya hanow a wra dewis nebonen y honen.


'Chons tew' dell leverir yn Sowsnek! 


Ha 'Gwas Gimbutas' a vydh y Vikar War An Nor.
Anselm

'Against a promontory my ship' Rump L. Stiltz-Kinn

'With regret I feel that unless you have a serious change of heart your presence at the Mennaye on Cornish Pirates match days is no longer desired.'
Rod Coward
CEO
Cornish Pirates

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Anselm
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Post by Anselm » Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:19 pm

Evertype said:
"Sensible comeback"? I chose not to respond because of your continued boorish disrespectful use of the epithet "Nynja".


Y krysav yn-hwir ni dhe glywes peub tra usi gans Gwas Gimbutas dh'y leverel, ha gorthbrevi peub tra oll. Gwell alemma yn-rag gasa kres dhodho.
Anselm

'Against a promontory my ship' Rump L. Stiltz-Kinn

'With regret I feel that unless you have a serious change of heart your presence at the Mennaye on Cornish Pirates match days is no longer desired.'
Rod Coward
CEO
Cornish Pirates

Karesk
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Post by Karesk » Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:36 pm

Anselm said:
pietercharles said:
Karesk said:
Cortes a via usya hanow a wra dewis nebonen y honen.


'Chons tew' dell leverir yn Sowsnek! 


Ha 'Gwas Gimbutas' a vydh y Vikar War An Nor.


Y a vynn kamgemeres dha gortesy rag ges.

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factotum
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Post by factotum » Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:24 am

Evertype said:
"Sensible comeback"? I chose not to respond because of your continued boorish disrespectful use of the epithet "Nynja".


I really wish, if you have nothing useful to contribute here, that you'd just do as you said and go away. It's funny really, to see you continually responding yet saying you not going to respond.


Margheg : It's a bloody comorant, I even produced the original photo that I used. Try looking for a shag round here.


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Marhak
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Post by Marhak » Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:41 am

It's not that easy to find a shag round here, either, but we manage, Keith, we manage
Now about the book which, I'll remind you, is what this thread's about even though it hasn't been mentioned for several pages.  I'm told that it's been given one hell of a review.

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Eddie-C
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Post by Eddie-C » Sun Nov 22, 2009 12:29 pm

I got my hands on a copy of 'Jowal Lethesow' last week, and have started reading it. The story is gripping and infused with the author's passion for the history and mythology of Kernow. The Cornish translation by Nicholas Williams is excellent, and the form of the book is to the same high standard we've come to expect from Evertype.

As for the diacritics: while I can understand some people's reluctance to type them, reading them is altogether a different thing. From my 30 or so years of typographical experience, it's apparent to me that Evertype has carefully chosen a body typeface where these marks are not excessively prominent. Thus, one can read the text quite unhindered by their presence, until one wants to check the value of a vowel to help parse a passage more clearly.

This book is an outstanding addition to the literature in Kernewek, and we can look forward to the remaining 2 parts of the trilogy coming out in translation in due course -- all of us, that is, except the usual crew of churlish begrudgers who notably produce nothing themselves other than hot (and foetid) air.


Anyway, it's worth remembering that KU and KUA each uses diacritics in reference and didactic material, and the former has continued to do so for almost 90 years --as did Jenner in the preceding decades. We heard no complaints then about how 'difficult' the marks were to read until KK's abortive 'hostile takeover' of the Revival in the mid 1980s. Of course, that was also when they started trying to persuade us that Cornish learners are (allegedly) too thick to learn anything other than ...KK.

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Evertype
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Post by Evertype » Sun Nov 22, 2009 1:29 pm

factotum said:

Evertype said:

"Sensible comeback"? I chose not to respond because of your continued boorish disrespectful use of the epithet "Nynja".

I really wish, if you have nothing useful to contribute here, that you'd just do as you said and go away. It's funny really, to see you continually responding yet saying you not going to respond.Who's to say that responding to you is a useful contribution anyway? You've obviously learnt some very peculiar things about linguistics, and pass all linguistic argument and data through a set of simplistic axioms. You've never actually listened to any of the discussion I or Dan have offered here; you can only see Cornish with the eyes of faith on the theoretical construct to which you've given your allegiance. Sadly, for you, at any rate, that places you squarely outside the mainstream, though you pretend otherwise.But anyway, so long as you insist on puerile nicknames, there's really no point. Unfortunately, that modicum of courtesy seems to be beyond you.

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Marhak
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Post by Marhak » Sun Nov 22, 2009 3:34 pm

One:  No, I would not like to share it with you (especially you).  You can find it for yourself.
Two:  KU was around for 60 years before KK – rather more than 'a few years', but that's typical of your manipulation of the facts.
Three: for 'launch' read 'imposition'.
Four:  'Kensa Lyver Redya', translated by Eddie is published in KS, so he DOES use it.  But, then, you knew that before telling your lies.

pietercharles
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Post by pietercharles » Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:06 pm


Eddie-C said:
Of course, that was also when they started trying to persuade us that Cornish learners are (allegedly) too thick to learn anything other than ...KK.


No, I have to correct you there, Eddie-C.
'They' never tried to persuade anyone that that was the case.  Evidence?
The boot was firmly on the other foot, and you can still read about it on the Cornishorthography group.
There's not much written here on C24 that can be backed up with evidence for all to see, but this can.
It was people that worked on KS who wrote, on Cornishorthography, that to suggest that KK was easier to learn than other orthographies was tantamount to calling the Cornish stupid.  KK people never suggested that.  KS people did.
It was people that worked on KS who wrote, on Cornishorthography, that to suggest that Cornish was better off for having an orthography that more reliably indicated how to pronounce a word was tantamount to calling the Cornish stupid.  KK people never suggested that.  KS people did.
And then, before the ink was dry on the SWF agreement, they went off and devised yet another orthography, which they tell everyone is easier for learners and very reliably indicates how to pronounce a word.  Tantamount, in their terms, to devising an orthography for people they perceive to be stupid.
Which may explain why so few people take what KS people say at all seriously.

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Marhak
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Post by Marhak » Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:27 pm

Oh, do look, everyone.  Pieter is asking for evidence again.  Have you ever noticed that he/she never offers any – even when asked?
KS was evolved well before any SWF agreement, as well Pieter knows, but, of course, facts are there to be misrepresented.  In fact, it worked quite closely with the KD project, both looking for a compromise solution to submit to the Commission.  It was a cooperation that worked rather well, to the point that, when submissions were produced, the two were workably close to each other.  KD did not carry on after the SWF agreement.  KS, on the other hand, carried on looking for further improvements.
The Kesva and the Cowethas purported to cater for all tastes.  In fact, they produced nothing but KK publications.  The Kesva concentrated on KK exams, paid lip service to UC exams and ignored the rest (UCR and Late Cornish).
Both Agan Tavas and Cussel an Tavas Kernewek remained honest.  The former supported primarily UC, but also derivatives firmly based upon textual (traditional) grammar and spelling.  The Cussel promoted and published Late Cornish.  Both publicised those facts about what they stood for, and did not seek to misrepresent themselves to anyone.

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