Do you think Cornish is difficult?

A new forum dedicated to Kernewek - the Cornish language, Cornish culture and the history of the Duchy of Cornwall
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Marhak
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Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 1:38 pm

For the new novel I've just started, I've had to get some smatterings of Euskara (Basque). Bloody hell! The holes I dig for myself! Nothing was printed in Euskara until the 16th century and it's been standardised more recently, but it was 16th century Euskara I was really after. Have found quite a lengthy text written in 1596 - nigh on perfect for what I want.

Here's what we call An Pader, in C16 Euskara:

Aita gurea,
Zeruetan zagozana.
Santifikadua izan dila zure izena
Etorri bidi
gugana zure Ereinua
Egin bidi zure borondatea,
nolan Zeruan, alan lurrean
emon egiguzu egunean
eguneango gure ogla
da parkatu
egiguzuz
gure pekatuak,
guk geure zordunai
parketan ddeusteguna legez
da etxi ez eiguzu
jausten tentazinoan,
baia libradu gaigizuz
gatx gustirik. Amen Iesus.

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Marhak
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 1:38 pm

the double d in the 5th line up should be a single one.

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factotum
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by factotum » Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:18 pm

http://www.buber.net/Basque/Euskara/Lar ... asque.html
But please note: I do not want to hear about the following:

Your latest proof that Basque is related to Iberian / Etruscan / Pictish / Sumerian / Minoan / Tibetan / Isthmus Zapotec / Martian

Your discovery that Basque is the secret key to understanding the Ogam inscriptions / the Phaistos disc / the Easter Island carvings / the Egyptian Book of the Dead / the Qabbala / the prophecies of Nostradamus / your PC manual / the movements of the New York Stock Exchange

Your belief that Basque is the ancestral language of all humankind / a remnant of the speech of lost Atlantis / the language of the vanished civilization of Antarctica / evidence of visitors from Proxima Centauri

I definitely do not want to hear about these scholarly breakthroughs.
---------

Note the following :
For centuries there was no standard orthography, and Basque was written with Romance spelling conventions supplemented by various additional devices to represent sounds not present in Romance. During the early years of the 20th century, a bizarre and impractical orthography employing a blizzard of pointless diacritics was widely used; this largely disappeared after the Spanish Civil War. In 1964 the Royal Basque Language Academy (Euskaltzaindia) promulgated a new standard orthography; this met some resistance at first but is now almost universally used.
So it looks like its just a stage we have to pass through.

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factotum
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by factotum » Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:25 pm

Margheg, if you want to look into Basque etymology the best source in English is online here :

http://www.sussex.ac.uk/linguistics/doc ... 08_edb.pdf

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Marhak
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:03 pm

Thank you. Of course I'm not interested in the crackpot theories, but am interested (not for the purposes of the novel) in Oppenheimer's suggestion that an early form of Basque might have been the earliest language spoke in Britain after post-Ice Age recolonisation. He uses genetic research as support for a theory that there was an Ice Age refuge in the shadow of the northern Pyrenees, and that the first repopulation of a Britain then empty of human genetics was from there. It certainly seems that Euskara is descended from a pre-Indo-European language.

With the novel, which is based on a real historical event, Captain Carlos de Amezola's name is a place-name, the place being to the south of Bilboa. The name is Basque, meaning 'abounding in oaks'; and it's probably no coincidence that his flagship was named after the dedication of the Basilica in Bilbao. It's probable that Amezola himself was Basque (and the Basques are reputed to be among the world's finest mariners) and this is why I needed some 16th century Euskara. Several have helped on this, and I'm grateful to all.

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Marhak
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:04 pm

I meant Bilbao!

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Marhak
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 4:13 pm

There is some confusion over the captain's name. Several historians refer to him as Carlos de Amesquita - this stems from a mistake made in a document written by Juan del Aguila y Arellano, Governor of Blavet (Port Louis, Brittany) 1591-98, in which he calls the captain "Carlos de Amezqueta". Amezola's own report to Philip II of Spain, after the raid, names himself as Amezola, and who better than the captain to know his own name? A ltter written by Philip II in 1596 also names him as Carlos de Amezola.

There's a little confusion in the names of the four galleys as well. One list gives: Capitana, Patrona, Peregrina and Basana. Peregrina and Basana (also Bazana) are definites, but a 'capitana' was a flagship. Her name was, in fact, Nuestra Senora de Begona. The deputy flagship in a fleet or squadron is the 'patrona', and this galley's real name was Salvador.

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Marhak
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 7:37 pm

These were galleys (galeras), not galleons. They were beautiful craft; 51-60m in length, two-masted, each with a large triangular lateen sail (much like an Arab dhow), with 25 banks of oars. 3 oarsmen to an oar = 150 oarsmen. They also carried 150 soldiers each, and displaced about 250 tons (Amezola never landed more than two-thirds of his soldiers at any one time). 5 bow-mounted guns, the biggest of them in the middle, so each had to manoeuvre bow-on to the target. Beautifully streamlined clipper-type bows, with a long square section bowsprit set horizontally, not raked upward like most (otherwise the bow-mounted guns would have shot it off!). Each also carried two large pinnaces for landing, so that the 4 galleys could land 150 men at a time.

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Marhak
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Re: Do you think Cornish is difficult?

Post by Marhak » Mon Nov 08, 2010 11:39 pm

What isn't generally known is that there were several reasons and intentions behind the Spanish raid of 1595. It wasn't just revenge for Cadiz or the Armada, and to give Lizzie Tudor a bloody nose, but these as well:

To ignite another Catholic insurrection from within Cornwall. This is one of the reasons that Amezola had the English Catholic Capt, Richard Burley of Weymouth, on board. Not only to be pilot of a shore he knew well, but to contact influential families who remained underground Catholics. He appears to have been a close friend to Amezola, and was certainly signed up to the Spanish royal navy (Amezola's account says as much). On the second of the two full days they were here, there is no mention of Burley. Where was he? What was he doing? This intention would appear to be why the body count was so low. We only know of three Cornish deaths (possibly four), while the Spaniards lost none until taking on an escorted Dutch fleet on the way home (where they lost 20). Was Amezola intent upon capturing "hearts and minds" locally? Did he instruct that anyone with a firearm was a legitimate target, but others should have their heads fired over? Sir Francis Godolphin admitted that, of the men he gathered for the initial attempt to defend Penzance, only 30 or 40 had guns, and only a third of those were capable of being fired! No wonder they cut and run, when 400 helmeted, breastplated Spanish soldiers, armed to the teeth, were marching around them in tight, disciplined formations, and generally taking the mick. Plus carefully placed cannon shot from the galleys. Burley is very much a mystery man. His name, place of origin, faith and service with the Spanish navy are all that's known of him. Burley and his role was what really sparked this idea for a novel.

Also, to reconnoitre the Isles of Scilly, and assess the strength of their defences, because the Spaniards had a notion of capturing the islands to use as a base for their own ships. This was to happened on the way back, but the Peregrina had sprung a bad leak and, in order to nurse her home, that Scillonian expedition had to be put aside. Not that it stopped them from taking on a 46-ship fleet off the Pointe du Raz and sinking two of them! (Thomas Treffry's account claimed that one of the galleys was sunk, but it is clear that all four reached Blavet safely).

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